Labor out of the picture
January 24, 2008 by mlq3
Filed under Daily Dose
Check out today’s Business Mirror editorial, on some interesting stock market-friendly legislation poised for passage. In the news, Palace fiat jump-starts national identification system plan (I support a national ID system). Also, Bishops in Palace: What’s wrong with it?True. It’s not as if any should doubt those bishops are Palace acolytes.
Meanwhile, Southeast Asia Vulnerable To Us Recession–Imf. See The Economist’s Next stop Asia? How an American recession might hit Asia:
Asian stockmarkets were until recently big fans of the “decoupling†theory: the notion that Asian economies can shrug off an American recession. This week’s plunge in shares, taking the MSCI Emerging Asia Index down by 25% at one point from its October high, suggests they have changed their minds. But the fact that Asian markets have not decoupled does not necessarily mean that their economies will follow America’s over a cliff.
Decoupling was always a misnomer, seeming to imply that an American recession would have no impact on Asia. In fact exports and hence profits would certainly be reduced. The pertinent argument is that they would be hurt by much less than in previous American downturns.
As well as hitting exports, America’s troubles could affect Asia through various financial channels. Asia’s exposure to the subprime mess is thought to be much smaller than that of American or European banks. Even so, Chinese bank shares tumbled this week on rumours that they would have to make much bigger write-downs on their holdings of American subprime securities. And if stockmarkets slide further as global investors flee from risky assets, this could dampen business and consumer confidence in the region.
Some Asian economies are more vulnerable than others: Singapore, Hong Kong and Malaysia have exports to America equivalent to 20% or more of their GDPs, compared with only 8% in China and 2% in India. There are already some ominous signs. Singapore’s exports to America are down by 11% over the past year, while Malaysia’s fell by 16%. Exports to other emerging economies and to the European Union surged, so total exports still grew by 6% in both economies. But that was much slower than at the start of the year, and the worry now is that demand from Europe has started to flag.
The growth in China’s exports to America slowed to only 1% (in yuan terms) in the year to December from over 20% in late 2006. So far the impact on GDP growth has been modest. Figures on China’s fourth-quarter GDP are to be published on Thursday January 24th and most economists expect growth to slow to a still healthy 9-10% this year.
China’s economy would probably still expand by around 8-9% even if export growth dried up. During the 2001 American recession China’s GDP barely slowed. In contrast, Hong Kong, Singapore, Taiwan and Malaysia suffered full-blown recessions. America’s recession this time is likely to be deeper than in 2001 and Asia is now more integrated into the global economy. Doomsters conclude, therefore, that these economies could be hit harder this time.
The main reason to be more optimistic is that domestic demand (consumer spending and investment) is likely to remain strong and governments have more flexibility. Last year, despite a slowdown in America’s imports, most Asian economies grew faster as domestic demand speeded up. Robert Prior-Wandesforde, an economist at HSBC, says that those who argue that Asian economies cannot decouple from America are ignoring the fact that they already have. Take Malaysia: exports to America plunged, yet its GDP growth quickened from 5.7% at the end of 2006 to 6.7% in the third quarter of last year.
Something an Israeli businessman asked me about before Christmas, and which turns out to be true: Oil smuggling costs govt P16B yearly.
My column for today is, A familiar passage, more in a Suharto-esque vein. See “Memory holes” by Juan Mercado, too:
Filipinos have “a very special problem†in recalling, Ateneo de Manila University president Bienvenido Nebres, S.J. observes. “It is not just wrong memories. It is the lack of a national memory… The consequence is, we tend to live in a perpetual present. We have little collective memory of the past and thus we can not see well into the future.â€
In his novel “1984,†George Orwell depicted a country where citizens thrust into a “memory hole†anything that crossed the whim of rulers. As “memory holes†shredded remembrance, wrong became right, lies replaced truth, and freedom turned into slavery.
Like malign genies, blotted-out memories don’t stay bottled up. They deform daily life. Thus, Imelda Marcos insists that Ferdinand Marcos’ dictatorship was the “most democratic period in our history.†The communists claim that “majority of (pogrom) victims decided to continue their work,†even praising the carnage. Estrada? Well, some days he can’t recall if his name is Jose Velarde.
All the hullaballoo about the 50th anniversary of SM (see SM through half a century), oddly enough, never mentions how salespeople remain contractual, and have had their contracts reduced to 3 months instead of 6 months as before. As the different political groups start marshaling their forces in preparation for the political engagements to come -whether a referendum campaign for or against constitutional amendments, or for the 2010 elections- the labor vote will be courted.
Yet the labor force, perhaps well-organized for certain unions, remains relatively small and if the May 1 mobilizations are any guide, seem to be shrinking. Unions didn’t prevent the collapse of certain industries, such as textile factories, have remained static in others such as the transport industry, and has no presence in growing ones such as call centers or the hi-tech manufacturing ones; they can’t have a presence in other countries yet sympathetic groups have been marginally successful in terms of mobilizing the OFW vote (potentially immense).
For example, would any effort to mobilize contractual workers at SM result in anything but opening up more contractual jobs? A strike would simply create huge lines for other citizens eager for any sort of SM-related job. Workers picketed PLDT for months but the country shrugged off the news, even when some of the workers claimed they were assaulted.
As entrepreneurship is encouraged, so will an anti-union mentality. And the unions themselves, how can they muster the clout necessary to cater to their members’ needs, when unemployment is so high, which makes any kind of employment desirable and permanent employment a losing proposition for most employers?
On a related note, Filipino entrepreneurs lack ‘culture of innovation’–DOST.
Let me play catch-up with stories that deserve to be followed, but which I haven’t had time to tackle.
1. The revival of Constitutional amendments proposals
Dan Mariano in his column points to
At the Kapihan sa Sulo media forum Saturday, Bataan Gov. Enrique “Tet†Garcia unveiled what he described as a “workable proposal†for Cha-cha through a second PI.
The Union of Local Officials of the Philippines (ULAP), he said, is “seriously considering [another] people’s initiative in proposing amendments to the Constitution to change the present [bicameral] Congress into a unicameral legislative body. That’s all.â€
Garcia said that the presidential form of government “shall be maintained to uphold the right of voters to directly elect their chief executive.â€
This is just one of several trial balloons. There’s Malacañang ally files House bill making all elected terms 5 years, and there are other proposals to Federalize the country, etc: Philippine Government Drafts Constitutional Amendment to Create Muslim Homeland. See also Gonzales for scrapping Comelec through Charter change. And Nograles proposes election of Con-con delegates in 2010.
Cities reel from unseen IRA cuts suggests one motivation for amendments moves: the expenses of the 3 year term and frequent elections, a business class increasingly able to say no to political demands, at least during campaign season, may be conspiring to push local government leaders to pursue brinkmanship in terms of constitutional changes. The different proposals emerging (trial balloons, as I’ve said) all seem to have gotten the hint from last year’s Cha-Cha debate: no one seems to be seriously proposing parliamentary government, but having thrown in the towel as far as trying to scrap the presidential system is concerned, unicameralism and federalism are being put back on the table.
Meanwhile, Cito Beltran has a point that in places where it’s needed, the national government lacks the political will to confront what Beltran calls Little republics of anarchy. Still, gerrymandering will continue apace, it seems: Mayors oppose bill relaxing cityhood: Local officials contend creating more cities will reduce IRAs for existing cities.
Fr. Joaquin Bernas SJ recently discussed Surgical constitutional change. Reforms enabling state subsidies for political parties, and bloc voting, don’t require constitutional amendments, though.
2. The downgrading of our airport rankings
Let’s start with What US air inspectors found unsafe (most embarrassing of all, on the eve that the unfavorable findings were released, Naia circuit box stolen, which had left the fence beside SLEX without lights for two days). The result? Arroyo fires aviation chief: US Embassy tells citizens to avoid RP airlines (and which derailed PAL’s expansion plans). Meanwhile, damage control: NAIA complies with ICAO standards–MIAA.
So, could it be, Aviation deficiencies resolved by April? Yet RP air talks mostly in limbo. But in the meantime, Another blow to PAL: Forwarders migrating.
For a thorough look at the situation, see this feature by Recto Mercene, who used to be an air traffic controller (of whom we have too few, and who are overworked): Dreams a-crashing to the ground.
3.ZTE continues to fester
While DOTC pushes ‘broadband’: New name, new partners, same network project, the autopsy of ZTE proceeds slowly. A comparison of ZTE’s prices, compared to prevalent prices in the industry, only appeared last Wednesday in the column of Jarius Bondoc (see the informative table in his column). You can verify, for yourself, if you’re technically inclined, whether Bondoc is on to something, or not. See the long-awaited NBN Contract Annexes (for example, in Yugatech’s initial NBN contract reaction, he mentioned that the annexes would be crucial to determining if the contract was really fishy or not).
4. Zubiri in trouble
Last August, in Newsstand, John Nery wrote this, concerning Juan Miguel Zubiri:
He has filed an absurd counter-protest against rival candidate Aquilino “Koko†Pimentel III before the Senate Electoral Tribunal, contesting the results of a jaw-dropping 73,000 precincts. (That’s one-third of the entire country.)
I do not know if the SET will give his counter-protest due course; considering that Pimentel didn’t even have enough campaign funds to show more than a handful of TV spots featuring top celebrity endorser Angel Locsin, the claim that he cheated massively is preposterous.
But Zubiri does not need to prove his allegation of election fraud. All he needs to do is tie up the SET in an interminable recount. Pimentel, who believes he was cheated in 2,680 precincts in a total of seven provinces, is confident that the review of election returns he is contesting would be completed in half a year or so. Zubiri’s protest, on the other hand, would take years to resolve.
Redemption? More like a ruthless gaming of the system. The “Senator from Maguindanao†has cynically exploited the limitations of our election rules, to hold on to his job.
Pimentel’s protest has creaked along and while Is it hello Pimentel, goodbye Zubiri? Not quite, it’s enough to have An OFW in Hong Kong comment, sarcastically, he’s convinced Zubiri won -by cheating:
Now that the ballot boxes are being opened for revision (examination to establish correctness), it has even become clearer that all accusations made against Zubiri (and this administration) regarding manipulation of election results in many parts of Mindanao were true.
For how can you explain (a) empty ballot boxes? (b) Ballot boxes containing ballots filled up by one distinct handwriting only? (c) Ballots inside those boxes without the security seals? It’s clear as day, cheating was done!
As expected, the winning senator will not easily abandon his post. That was part of the sham: to be proclaimed as fast as possible because they know that election protests are decided only after soooo looong! Zubiri is now counting on that proven way to cling to a stolen post.
Hence Lakas-CMD projecting Zubiri as one of its spokesmen, as the party wrestles with its lack of real presidential timber, and the “going on leave” of the President’s son, and fresh rumors of the Speaker being toppled when the House resumes its sessions.
In the blogosphere, The Philosophical Bastard reflects on a comment in this blog. Thoughts on what should government’s role be, in Willing Exile:
If we are to look closely at the things that work for us — private initiative in providing services for those who can afford them, courage and determination to work overseas to make extra dollars, contributions by the sectarians in moving education to a higher level (memo to UP on the celebration of your centennial: in five years, if not less, DLSU will overtake you as the pre-eminent Philippine university in terms of academic reputation, quality of graduates, and infrastructure. Accelerate reform now!), innovation and ingenuity in micro-level enterprises — is that in an environment where individual effort and contribution, fairness, excellence, and quality are observed, we do well.
Government’s role has expanded to that point where it has to intervene in everything. When it does that, it tends to stultify initiative and individualism and thus promotes mendicancy and stagnation. Instead of helping themselves, our people point the finger on others, and mostly on the government. Unfortunately, despite our socialist policy efforts, we cannot aspire to become a welfare state like those in Scandinavia. Given the mad scramble of these states to enlist foreign workers to support their retiring citizens, that system is flawed as well.
Methinks the government’s role in most public spheres is to generate consensus to reduce duplication of activities, support innovation, set fair standards. and then punish violators vigorously. This model will definitely work in business, education, sport — while the government can focus on securing our borders within and without, fostering healthy international relations, and promoting cultural identity.
Still, while we can go on theorizing models of government, it still bears to remember that without a proper culture of public service, any model is guaranteed to fail, as it is doing poorly right now in the Philippines. Change must come from the top, while those below must keep on pushing to ensure that happens. To be a truly “strong republic” the citizens will have to be “strong” in mind themselves.
Basapa tackles Why the Philippines Government Can’t Stop Filipinas from Having an Abortion.
And Gridcrosser Files on the Comedia.
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benign0 on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 1:46 pm
“All the hullaballoo about the 50th anniversary of SM (see SM through half a century), oddly enough, never mentions how salespeople remain contractual, and have had their contracts reduced to 3 months instead of 6 months as before.”
The three paragraphs following this statement of yours can be summarised in three words: BECAUSE THEY (business) CAN.
The way labour is treated or the degree of organisation they exhibit (dismal) is merely a reflection of the demand for labour in the Philippine economy (also dismal).
And anybody whose actually transacted with an SM saleslady straightaway can tell that each one of them is as easily replaceable as the next country lass fresh of the boat in North Harbour.
Levy on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 2:43 pm
Indeed, it is unfortunate that in order to preserve their jobs, these contractual workers would much rather endure substandard working conditions rather than fighting for their rights either through collective bargaining or the courts. (whether a worker can attain justice at the national labor relations commission is, of course, another story altogether)
hendrick on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 2:59 pm
many readers. Wow!
I like your show.
nash on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 4:47 pm
“2. The downgrading of our airport rankings”
- ooh, it took them so long? they should have done a tactic commonly used by the semiconductor industry when auditors come – only show them what you want them to see, don’t let them wander on their own.
cvj on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 5:10 pm
I’m interested in looking at Jarius’ comparison but the above link does not go to his column.
cvj on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 5:18 pm
On the contractualization issue, i wonder if bringing in competition via MNCs like Walmart (nothwidthstanding the stories) will bid up the salaries & working treatment of the sales staff or whether it will just destroy local enterprise. If the result is a little of both, then what should we as a society value more?
The Ca t on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 5:21 pm
I was accused of having crab mentality when I brought this to the picture re: success stories about tycoons.
Siguro, hindi lang crab ang tawag sa akin pag sinabi ko na some of these billionaire businessmen buy union leaders too.
And I am not naming names. bwahaha
The Ca t on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 5:45 pm
Most of the US subprime mortgages were sold to European banks. And that’s how they are going to be affected. Bad debts and write-offs.
US banks buy NPL (Non-performing loans from Asian banks.
And that’s how these banks are going to be affected. No more buyers for their bad debts.
The Ca t on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 6:10 pm
Read: contractual.
After 90 days, there is no more employer-employee relationship. If you do not want the conditions, then don’t sign the contract. That’s it. What rights are they going to fight for? The only reason that they can bring a case to the court is if there is a stipulation that they need to be informed one month advance if their contract is going to be renewed and the management failed to do it. But there is also the cost problem and the job opportunity lost while the case is being litigated.
Retail stores in the US hire seasonal/contractual employees too, two months before Christmas, good up to January. That’s the time when consumer spending goes down and so are sales.
They retain some on a part-time basis.They become regulars with less than 32 hour-week schedule so they don’t enjoy benefits but this is precisely the reason of the employers to keep sales people on a contractual or on a part-time basis– to save on benefits,social security and the likes.
Probationary period for newly-hired employees in the US is usually three months or 90 days. During the period, the employees are not entitled to benefits yet and can be terminated anytime when performance is below the expectation. But they can still extend it to 30 or more days. That’s still great savings.
nash on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 7:11 pm
Fear NOT! We have sent a crack team of technocrats and the brightest minds to Davos to stop this recession.
“ZURICH, Switzerland — President Gloria Macapagal-Arroyo flew to the World Economic Forum in Switzerland with an 86-member delegation composed of top Cabinet officials and lawmakers, including the wife of murder convict Jose Villarosa.
The number of delegates came as a surprise to some since the Philippines would figure little in the discussions at the annual gathering of world leaders and business executives.”
@Cat: Ganun talaga yun. It’s one of the best defenses we have, to use “crab mentality” carte blanche in argument.
Carl on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 7:26 pm
This early and Mar Roxas is already pandering to the poor by pushing for the suspension of EVAT on oil. He argues that suspension of EVAT will result in direct savings to the poor which will ease their burden amid rising prices.
Oh really? Will a roll-back in oil prices resulting from EVAT suspension convince Piston et all to roll back fares as well? How many times did a roll-back in diesel prices convinced these militant transport groups to correspondingly correct their fares? Only transport operators and drivers will directly benefit from EVAT suspension (who by the way do not pay income taxes), aside from the SUV driving elites. The rest of the the jeepney riding public, yes commuting employees who fully pay taxes their taxes monthly, gets to pay the same fare. You call that social equity?
We’ve been experiencing historic lows in inflation – that’s what you call real and direct benefit for the poor. All because this administration is serious and is so far successful in managing the fiscal deficit. Take the EVAT on oil and our ambition to balance the budget goes out of the window. And there goes your inflation targets. That’s Keynesian (aka “Trickle Downâ€) economics, but that will do for now until we the public gain enough trust in our institutions to let it implement socially democratic reforms.
Wanna know the real Mar Roxas? Try talking to a businessman in Roxas City in Capiz and get to know how development has languished in that part of the country because the Roxas family who has substantial business interests there are quite successful in keeping competition out. Mr. Palengke, my ass.
UP n student on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 7:32 pm
“It is not just wrong memories. It is the lack of a national memory… The consequence is, we tend to live in a perpetual present. We have little collective memory of the past and thus we can not see well into the future.â€
Add to this, the predilection of Malacanang residents to hold closed-door meetings (with Catholic bishops, with Muslim mayors, with the Ayalas and Gokongweis).
So is there a law that addresses which transactions by the Executive branch are required to be recorded for posterity? [This has to be a law and none of that B/S "moral obligation"-stuff. The law should also stipulate the amount of time that the contents of the transaction can remain 'privileged communications' and outside the public domain.]
Carl on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 7:35 pm
Cvj, I’m afraid it will be ineffective because demand for labor of this type will hardly change even with new competitors as we have an overwhelming supply of unemployed people.
BrianB on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 9:37 pm
SM Shoemart reminds me of a novel by Zola I read about 2 years ago: The Ladies Paradise. SM has a lot in common with the mega department stores of the 19th century. Very eerie.
BrianB on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 9:39 pm
Who forgets? This statement is prejudicial to the masses. People rarely forget. It’s the establishment that forces them to forget by delaying justice to perpetuity.
Levy on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 10:03 pm
Cat,
Yes, there are employees who are hired on a fixed-term basis so that at the end of the contract, employer-employee relationship is terminated. But what about those ‘contractual’ employees whose contracts are repeatedly renewed in order to prevent them from becoming regular employees under the law? I reckon these are the employees being referred to in the SM case. I know for a fact that some ‘contractual’ employees there have been working for more than 10 years but the store refuses to recognize them as regular employees.
cvj on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 10:08 pm
Carl, perhaps you’re right. For this reason, i’m of two minds regarding further liberalizing the retail sector.
vic on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 10:52 pm
The Best the Contractual workers can ask is for the Labour Dept. to give them some benefits (like half the full time) since most of them work on continuous basis..
Half of our staff at work are students on part time basis and some as their second job, and they are given half the benefits of the full time..not a bad deal…
cvj on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 11:01 pm
I finally got to see Bondoc’s article (via Google cache). I don’t have anything to say about the equipment price discrepancies since i’m not from the Telecoms industry, but based on my experience in Systems Integration type projects, i agree that the Engineering Services component is grossly overpriced. Unfortunately, Annexes C to J giving the details are not available (at least i can’t find it in the Inquirer site).
On a related note, here’s how Singapore approaches its own [Next Generation] National Broadband Network program:
http://www.ida.gov.sg/News%20and%20Events/20071211184512.aspx?getPagetype=20
The above is a press release for the ‘NetCo’ (i.e. passive infrastructure component).
The tender will close on March 25, 2008.
UP n student on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 11:42 pm
Levy asks : …. But what about those ‘contractual’ employees whose contracts are repeatedly renewed in order to prevent them from becoming regular employees under the law? … I know for a fact that some ‘contractual’ employees there have been working for more than 10 years but the store refuses to recognize them as regular employees.”
What this says is that the Philippine laws allow this situation to exist. The elected LEGISLATIVE BRANCH has not taken on the issue. And the failure is equally, if not more on the labor unions, the various church denominations, the university intelligentsia.
Carl on Thu, 24th Jan 2008 11:57 pm
Consumers can exert pressure on SM to stop contracting workers by supporting competitors that foster fair labor practices. For example, I make it a point to tell officemates to buy from Rustan’s instead of SM because Rustan’s salespeople are permanent employees. The premium you pay for buying at Rustan’s goes a long way in providing for the welfare of its employees.
cvj on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 12:14 am
By saying the above, i do hope you’re not giving a Benign0-esque free pass to Henry Sy and Company.
Carl on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 12:17 am
In fairness, the Catholic clergy has been critical of SM’s labor practice.
The blame squarely rests on the government because it abdicated on its role in regulating and policing the labor market. The executive branch, for cozying up with big business and turning a blind eye. The legislative branch, for its wrong sense of proportion in pursuing the bigger evils of our society.
nash on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 12:20 am
oo nga naman. anong kinalaman ng intelligentsia kay Henry Sy and company?
It’s basically one rich man flouting labor laws….he should be fined and all those loopholes on contractualisation be plugged.
pero upn has a point. methinks if the church didn’t interfere with our population programs kasi. siempre if there are 10,000,000 applicants, it’s an employers market….you take whatever, otherwise you starve.
nash on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 12:23 am
puleez, you think if I had $2B in the bank, I’d be affected by a ‘critical church’?
Betol on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 12:42 am
Philippine Airlines is still the cheapest Business and First Class ticket to Manila from Frisco, so I will always fly with them. Don’t fly coach on PAL though. It’s not the cheapest and the passengers are packed tighter than a virgin’s you know what.
hvrds on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 2:24 am
All these theoretical discussions on SM are in so many respects moot and academic. Is SM still a retailer or is SM a landlord?
Anyone who has experienced being a supplier to SM will know that a large section of SM is implicitly rented by concessionaires. That means a lot of the staff are not employees of SM.
The same can be said of the Ayalas. Are they landlords or are they retailers? The division of labor or in biz-speak the supply chain. The same with Robinsons.
Add to this advances in IT in POS systems (POINT of Sale Systems)the demand for labor is drastically cut.
supremo on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 2:57 am
You got it right hvrds.
supremo on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 3:48 am
The MILF, MNLF and other variations of the LF should take some lessons from the Inuits of Canada. Thet got their own homeland that is full of ice but still a homeland.
UP n student on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 3:53 am
In contrast to, say, the Aetas or the Igorots, the MNLF and MILF get a lot of attention because they carry and have repeatedly used guns, and the explosives they have detonated have reached into Metro-Manila.
UP n student on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 3:54 am
SuperFerry14!!!
supremo on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 4:27 am
They may have guns but they are not nearer their objective of having a homeland.
PDubSpEditor on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 4:51 am
“He has filed an absurd counter-protest against rival candidate Aquilino “Koko†Pimentel III before the Senate Electoral Tribunal, contesting the results of a jaw-dropping 73,000 precincts. (That’s one-third of the entire country.)”
- 73,000 precincts… That is preposterous, but that pretty boy pulled it off. Those SET guys would have been payed way too much if they let this one pass through, but I would not be surprised. That’s just outright cheating that is… The things those pigs (politicians) do for pork barrel.
“pero upn has a point. methinks if the church didn’t interfere with our population programs kasi. siempre if there are 10,000,000 applicants, it’s an employers market….you take whatever, otherwise you starve.” (nash)
@ Nash -Hmm… Can’t blame the church for that one, since it’s technically their prerogative to voice out their opinions, since we are predominantly Christian. We just need a DOH secretary or a president with real abs to defy the church (or create jobs, since the growth rate slowed down for last year, if I’m not mistaken)[Leaders with guts are in short supply, really rare to find those ones, so don't expect the population to slow down, anytime soon]…
hvrds on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 4:58 am
History is replete with instances of capitalists destroying capitalism with their excesses. It does create its own gravediggers if not for the emergence of the nation state and a fiat national currency system.
We have seen it happen again in the past few days. Underneath the iceberg of the securitization of debt and the other new forms of financial engineering the most deadly is turning out to be the credit default swaps (Insurance on the default of these new instruments.) Either the financial institutions who were primarily responsible for creating this instruments take the loses on to their books or the institutions that sold the insurance take the hit.
In the recent months both parties were taking hits and this was in turn destroying their capital base. Then this caused the bond markets to seize up in the commercial sector. This in turn caused the deadly spiral downward.
If the credit default swap markets collapsed all corporations and even governments who depend on the bond markets would have seen their interest rates rise dramatically making further skewing bank balance sheets that would have damaged bank balances sheet around the world.
It would have been the mother of all financial crisis.
Rey ‘the magician’ Tetangco would probably turn gay. He would have had to bend over and get it again from the IMF-WB in the butt.
He would have had to use the currency swap with Japan, the PRC and S. Korea.
The threat of a slowdown in the U.S. would have started a serious collapse of the entire complex derivatives markets bringing with it banks all around the world.
In substance but not in form another great crash of capitalism caused by capitalists themselves.
Thanks to Keynes and Friedman they all know they have a safety net – the nation state and their client states.
The government after all is the executive committee of capitalists.
For our very own GMA who is busy taking photo ops in Davos better make sure you sell enough of your IOU’s in Dubai when you get there to capture soem dollars from the OFW’s so you can pay for the new NBN project. Big Mike need the cash
supremo on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 5:26 am
US economy tentative stimulus plan
‘Under the plan, individuals would receive rebates of up to $600 and couples could receive $1,200, plus $300 per child, Paulson said. Rebates would be phased out for individuals earning more than $75,000 and couples earning more than $150,000. Individuals must earn at least $3,000 to get a $300 rebate.’
The target for distribution of checks is May. What do you have in the Philippines? Puro laway.
nash on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 5:58 am
@hvrds
you are correct. perhaps when we say ’sm’ we mean those employed in ’sm department store, groceries, watsons…” even then, whether there is 1 or 100 “sm” employees, they are still being untreated unfairly….but then again, henry sy is too big a fish to prosecute.
maybe the senator from maguindanao, future nobel prize in chemistry (biofuels) can help us…
@pdub….
It would be good if the monkeys in red robes were merely expressing their ‘opinion’. fact is they are arm-twisting government officials to their twisted logic. and even if we are a predominantly christian country, there is nowhere in our constitution that says the opinion of the majority religion should be given preferential treatment. but yes, the sad reality is that when we write the next constitution it should rename our country as “The CBCP Republic of The Philippines”.
Levy on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 6:35 am
“What this says is that the Philippine laws allow this situation to exist. The elected LEGISLATIVE BRANCH has not taken on the issue. And the failure is equally, if not more on the labor unions, the various church denominations, the university intelligentsia.”
I agree that loopholes in the law allow contractualization to exist. About the Church, it’s funny that you mentioned this because recently I gave a talk about contractualization to AMRSP (group of religious superiors). During the talk, they all agreed that contractualization is a bane to the working class. But when we got to the point of citing examples in schools/churches they were running, aba, biglang kabig at sabi ligal daw ang ginagawa nila.
Yes, one can fault the unions, etc. But what about the ‘contractual’ employee? Is he/she blameless in all of this? Walang mang-aapi kung walang magpapaapi.
“All these theoretical discussions on SM are in so many respects moot and academic. Is SM still a retailer or is SM a landlord?
Anyone who has experienced being a supplier to SM will know that a large section of SM is implicitly rented by concessionaires. That means a lot of the staff are not employees of SM.”
Yes, the trend right now is to slowly erode employer-employee relationship through outsourcing. Why go through all the headaches attendant to maintaining employees in the payroll when the employer can easily contract a third party to do the very same service? At the end of the day, bawas ang sakit ng ulo. The employer still reap the same profits and benefits of his/her business while at the same time lessening the number of employees under his/her care.
benign0 on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 6:43 am
“Add to this advances in IT in POS systems (POINT of Sale Systems)the demand for labor is drastically cut.”
Pinoys should be happy with the battallions of SM Girls employed by Henry Sy. If anyone’s experienced shopping in the West, you will see entire floors being manned by only two or three sales ladies. Compare that to SM where every rack and aisle is manned by one of Henry’s space cadets.
And yet, in these Western department stores, service is vastly superior and staff far more helpful and knowledgeable about the merchandise than the average SM chick.
The few personnel that man the shop floors both are brilliant multi-taskers. They serve merchandise broswers, man the cash registers, keep the merchandise orderly, and clean the floors.
In SM and other Pinoy stores, there are more personnel manning EACH P.O.S. station than it takes to crew up the average army tank — one to punch in the sale, another to stamp, countersign, and tape the receipt onto the item, and another to bag it.
Talaga naman oo. It’s no wonder that a country of almost 90 million is utterly dwarfed in ACHIEVEMENT and OUTPUT by even the smallest of European societies numbering less than 4 million.
hvrds on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 6:43 am
It would be interesting to check just how many rank and file employees are employed at SM directly and how many are actually working for labor contractors. That is the magic world of outsourcing being pushed by government policy makers.
If one wants to challenge this at the NLRC adjudicators you are in for a rude awakening. This is state policy. However fret not as the Labor Department and the POEA will assist you in your quest for overseas employment. Demand for overseas labor will remain to be strong.
The demographics (greying) and evolution of the advanced economies into post industrial societies open up a lot of opportunities for labor migration.
The up and coming brand for labor migration are Filipina caregivers and nannies. They are prized.
hawaiianguy on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 8:41 am
Words from an American scholar-critic:
Harry Magdoff, Imperialism Without Colonies (2003).
“In the decades after 1945, as colonial possessions became independent states, it was widely-believed that imperialism as a historical phenomenon was coming to an end. The six essays collected in this volume demonstrate that a new form of imperialism was, in fact, taking shape—an imperialism defined not by colonial rule but by the global capitalist market. From the outset, the dominant power in this imperialism without colonies was the United States.
“Magdoff’s essays explain how this imperialism works, why it generates ever greater inequality, repression, and militarism, and the essential role it plays in the development of U.S. capitalism.”
HARRY MAGDOFF has been a co-editor of Monthly Review since 1969 and is the author of The Age of Imperialism and Imperialism: From the Colonial Age to the Present.
hvrds on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 9:06 am
Getting back to reality . It was then President Bill Clinton and his Treasury Secretary Robert Rubin who fashioned the greatest repeal of the New Deal regulatory framework under Glass Steagall. Commercial banks were not allowed to go into investment banking. This repeal was done to favor Rubin’s present employer Citigroup. They merged Citibank and Weills Travelers Life.
This merging once again of investment banking and commercial banking lies at the heart of the de-regulatory framework that brought the world to this crisis again.
Guess who pays? The honest saver. His savings will pay him less in interest once again. All this to save the bankers once again.
Savings in the bank is not the same as investing in the equity or bond markets.
You counteract deflationary expectations by reducing interest to promote consumption but only in economies that have collapsing demand.
But what about countries that have underdeveloped productive capacities and in essence are not industrial economies.
How can the economy have a collapsed demand if there was no demand in the first place?
Savings are a long term product of sacrificing and deferring consumption. It is not about investing in the stock market. That is insane.
The old saying in the markets is clear. Bulls and bears take positions one way or another since they can withstand the cycles. It is the pigs that get slaughtered. There are no government guarantees for the ordinary investor in the markets.
There are for the owners of the institutions that manage other peoples money.
BrianB on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 9:55 am
“The target for distribution of checks is May. What do you have in the Philippines? Puro laway.”
We don’t need a stimulus package as we don’t even manufacture anything and I’m not sure Filipinos are going to give up what little affordable luxuries they have: Starbucks, spas, trips to HK. It’s the remittances and possible cutbacks on the outsourcing side that we should worry about.
TonGuE-tWisTeD on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 10:12 am
Whoa! Not so fast. “Blame the lawyers” would be more appropriate. The Herrera Law, tested by an old and poor but dedicated Atty. Fenandez (who uses a cane to walk) all the way to the Supreme Court, ended in a landmark decision that found such companies that hire contractual labor beyond 6 months via perpetual re-contracting as circumventing the law. Fernandez’ client, whose time card was not even presented to the court, worked uninterrupted for SIX MONTHS AND A WEEK and that was enough for the SC to award her reinstatement, full back wages and benefits for three years, without loss of seniority. I saw it with my own eyes, the embarassment of both company owners and lawyers, as the sheriff handed the document to the president saying he is not leaving until he sees the check in the complainant’s hands.
The dejected company lawyers rode their Mercedes Benzes back to their Tektite Towers shaking their heads. Atty. Fernandez hailed a cab to take him home.
To this day, perpetual re-contracting is still widely practiced as lawyers from both sides would, of course, prefer the long, circuitous route despite the more than 2 decades-old jurisprudence.
Remember Mercedes Benz and the taxicab.
cvj on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 10:16 am
Supremo, if the US stimulus package in the form of tax rebates or reductions is effective, do you think it would makes sense for the US government to actually set the tax rate to negative so that it could give more of that welcome stimulus?
TonGuE-tWisTeD on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 10:33 am
Sorry, it is not more than 2 decades-old. That is for the NLRC arbiter’s decision. The SC ruling came out more than 3 years later. Herrera Law did provide the maximum of 3 years for backpay computation compared to the old unlimited one. The difference is, in the old law, a complainant moots the case if he/she gets gainfully re-employed, Herrera’s allows the worker to get a life while the case undergoes trial.
BrianB on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 10:34 am
Has anyone researched the business model of SM in Xiamen China. Is it just as 19th century as the SMs here.
BrianB on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 10:37 am
SOMONE HAS TO WRITE A BOOK, MAKE A MOVIE ABOUT THIS ATTY. FERNANDEZ.
haven’t even hard of this, and I didn’t think this was possible in our country. When did this happen. Yes, take it to the supreme court, unless they are from the Cojuangco clan, which even with a supreme court ruling on your side, would remain untouchable.
raynan on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 10:57 am
uhmm, does anyone tackling weak dollar policy?
raynan on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 11:03 am
the crisis regarding the housing subprime loans, how was it? a series of recessions? a weak dollar policy resulting to recession? another issue? considering united states as the major trading partner, are we(philippines) anticipating to this issue?
mlq3 on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 11:04 am
cjv, you will enjoy this:
http://www.slate.com/id/2182353/
inodoro ni emilie on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 11:06 am
in the event of a u.s. recession, what’s there for our telebabadeers to attend product queries of?
BrianB on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 11:08 am
manolo, is the US rich is anything like the Philippine Rich…
Go fuck yourselves you poor bastards.
BrianB on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 11:10 am
Of course, on TV they’d be teary eyed with some pocket change thrown the poor’s way. This is their crass interpretation of Noblesse Oblige.
mlq3 on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 11:16 am
brian, i think one generalization we can make is that the wealthy around the world think alike. the british aristocrat or film star living abroad to avoid british income taxes and death duties, our own wealthy, the wealthy in indonesia, and the usa, are the ultimate practitioners of globalization.
mlq3 on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 11:27 am
but brian, there’s a reason the truly rich remain precisely that: rich. they’re kuripot.
BrianB on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 11:36 am
I don’t think the US situation is a matter of being kuripot. The problem there is that rich people don’t want other people to tell them what to do with their money. Remember Ted Turners donation to the US government?
It’s a matter of priorities. There are some rich Americans who’d choose their country over their wealth, without question.
cvj on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 11:37 am
Manolo, thanks for the pointer to Slate. Unfortunately for America (or maybe fortunately for the emerging markets), they may not get a Mahathir-type leader that will compel the rich to keep their capital at home.
supremo on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 11:49 am
cvj,
’set the tax rate to negative’
There are several tax rates ranging from 10% to 35%. There are tax brackets that correspond to those tax rates.
Let’s say a single taxpayer has a taxable income (income after all deductions) of $10000. The tax would be computed like this for 2007
$0 to $7,825 10% of the amount over $0
$7,826 to $31,850 $782.50 plus 15% of the amount over $7,825
The IRS do not change the tax rates just the brackets. It is required by law to adjust the dollar amounts based on the tax provisions each year to keep pace with inflation. No need to have a negative tax rate. The current system is confusing enough.
The nearest thing to a negative tax rate is the $1000 per child credit. This is separate from the child deduction. If your tax refund (you paid too much tax) is $10 and you have a kid, your final tax refund is $1010.
The Fed will think of another plan if more stimulus is needed. An example is if you buy a car that weighs at least 6000 pounds (think SUV) then you get some kind of rebate or deduction. Crazy but it happened in 2002.
TonGuE-tWisTeD on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 12:24 pm
BrianB,
The good old Atty. Fernandez is from a rare breed. Guess how much he charged the lady client – P2,500 for all those years of hardwork and sacrifice! That case I wrote about was but a small fraction of this poor guy’s legacy. And that overhauled many workers’ views about getting social justice and inspired budding lawyers who believed Don Quixote actually slew the windmill. Many similar cases have prospered since.
I know he published some books before he died, his mind remained sharp where his knees failed him. He never made money through lawyering, though, just enough to send his son through UP Law. They don’t make lawyers like him anymore.
May he rest in eternal peace.
—————–
As for SM’s contractualization, ad infinitum, the Labor Code Arts. 279 and 280 (now amended to consider even broken employment as regular, as long as it totalled one year) is explicit in prohibiting such practice. So does Department Order #3 (DOLE) which outlaws labor-only contracting/subcontracting.
Never mind if we have Section 3, Article XVI of the Constitution defining the State’s policy to assure the workers to security of tenure and free them from the bondage of uncertainty woven by some employers in these contracts. The implementors of the law in the executive are often in cahoots with the violators, or are violators themselves. They don’t even respect this Constitution. So much for rule of law.
As I replied to UP n student earlier, why blame everybody else when it’s the lawyers who are responsible for this social menace?
benign0 on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 1:15 pm
“but brian, there’s a reason the truly rich remain precisely that: rich. they’re kuripot.” — mlq3
I think this is not entirely true. The rich (those who legitimately acquired their wealth) see thing ordinary people don’t see. They see potential in what to most people are the most mundane of things (kind of like the way Pinoys see their forests merely as a cash crop — to be harvested and exported RAW, while more innovative societies see their forests as an asset that yields SUSTAINABLE income and benefits to wellbeing for GENERATIONS ahead).
Rich people scrimp on the things that don’t matter but would RISK sizeable chunks of their personal assets on things that have POTENTIAL.
Compare that to the ordinary Pinoy schmoe who would scrimp on their own kids’ education but then go out to splurge on the latest karaoke, celphone trinket, or ocho-ocho party.
Seeing the rich as merely kuripot is an underclass trait. Catholics are raised to regard generosity as a be-all end-all virtue. So we tend to lionise people who throw lavish parties and dole out wads of cash to “the hungry”. We were raised to remember that tired old parable about the camel fitting through the eye of the needle before the rich man could — all but forgetting that there is also a parable saying that servants who don’t invest their masters’ money profitably also go to hell.
This is the kind of mentality that elects visibly “generous” bozos like Erap (remember how the poor lined up at the gates of Malacanang?) to office. It is the mentality behind why voters can be bought by distributing sacks of rice to every barrio, and the reason behind why Pinoys turn straight to the ninong/ninang list to count the number of generals and senators whenever they receive an invitation to a wedding.
Maybe the rich are ‘kuripot’ because they themselves worked hard to accumulate their wealth and EXPECT OTHER PEOPLE to have the same attitude towards the aquisition of assets. Which is why they have a ‘tough luck’ attitude towards people who say “buti ka pa ang yaman mo”.
People who say “buti ka pa ang yaman mo” come across as people who think that wealth is a matter of luck or “blessing”. I think this is what annoys rich people (those who worked hard and risked a lot for their wealth) the most.
cvj on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 1:23 pm
cvj on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 1:24 pm
sorry the next paragraph above should be outside the blockquote.
UP n student on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 1:30 pm
TonGuE-tWisTeD : Based on what you state, the responsibility for SM contractualization legal convolution lies with the judges who rule on the cases (and any and all influence peddlers in the background). The worker loses because the judge, thru incompetence(lack of knowledge the Labor Code Arts. 279 and 280 you state), or thru culpability, pens the wrong decision on the case. The organizational structure has the local judges report to the Supreme Court, doesn’t it? And of course, blame is on any and all influence-peddlers in the background (and any incompetent labor union unable to get the Labor Laws implemented consistently).
benign0 on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 1:34 pm
“When a person risks sizeable chunks of their personal assets on things that have potential, is there a guarantee that they will be rewarded for taking such risks?”
Of course not. KAYA NGA ‘RISK’ E.
You can go through life with the notion that you are OWED a profit whenever you risk some capital on a venture. That kind of thinking is for morons.
benign0 on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 1:37 pm
I meant to say “You CAN’T go through life…” pala.
UP n student on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 1:39 pm
People interested should also google for “philippines ITUC trade union labor laws” to see what the international community reports.
BrianB on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 1:50 pm
“You can go through life with the notion that you are OWED a profit whenever you risk some capital on a venture. That kind of thinking is for morons.”
I think one of the older Lopezes once said something like they deserve their “due return for their investment.” I tried writing a short letter to the inquirer describing how stupid such a statement was coming from a businessman. The thinking of these people…. The most primitive Filipinos are not the aetas in their land reserves but these conglomerate families.
inodoro ni emilie on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 2:32 pm
only if the servants were charged to do so. but if these servants earned that money it is up to them to decide how to spend it: if the money is earned, then it’s theirs.
Jeg on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 2:40 pm
while more innovative societies see their forests as an asset that yields SUSTAINABLE income and benefits to wellbeing for GENERATIONS ahead)
What Im batting for is a society that sees their forests as capital. That’s not innovation. That’s just common sense.
But I think MLQ3 means the old rich, benny. The stagnant, old rich. Not the kind you were talking about in your comment.
cvj on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 2:42 pm
I thought so as well. If that’s the case, then that would open up the possibility of people who have risk-[ed] sizeable chunks of their personal assets on things that have potential but for one reason or another did not succeed. Do you have an idea of the relative proportion of those who succeeded and those who did not? And of those who did not, are they to be considered, in your words, ‘morons’?
TonGuE-tWisTeD on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 3:03 pm
UP n student,
But the courts only decide on cases as they are presented by the lawyers. Those lawyers who can not (or will not, intentionally) anchor their arguments on solid ground such as the laws I’ve mentioned are doomed to lose from the start. In racetrack lingo it’s called “biyahe”.
Look at the list of cases decided after that landmark case, even industry heavyweights represented by topnotch law firms, it would seem, were gypped by their counsels into fighting an expensive lost cause. On the other hand, unions struggle with payday collections for retainers that don’t win them cases. Pepsi, Philips, Purefoods are some examples.
More workers/unions are now better informed of their rights as are the employers that very few such cases are now taken up in the Supreme Court. The best thing that happened is that many firms have avoided the practice completely.
I don’t know how SM can still get away with it though.
benign0 on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 5:06 pm
“Do you have an idea of the relative proportion of those who succeeded and those who did not? And of those who did not, are they to be considered, in your words, ‘morons’?”
Nope. I called ‘morons’ those who live by the notion that they are owed a profitable outcome whenever they risked some capital.
As for the relative proportion stats you — as is typical of you — requested. My answer is: I don’t know. What’s the point in knowing that? If someone told you that 80% of people who invested in a lechon manok stand succeeded, will that make you any more comfortable or uncomfortable with starting a lechon manok business?
cvj on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 5:48 pm
Thanks Benign0, i wanted to find out whether you had a way of determining how many are, and are not ‘morons’ in Philippine society. From what you’ve said, you can only identify the subset of ‘non-morons’ who have already succeeded in getting rich.
benign0 on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 6:06 pm
cvj,
Yet again you didn’t get it.
The moron statement I made had nothing to do with how many succeeded and how many failed as businessmen.
My statement was to do with people who entertain the notion that they are owed a profitable outcome (by God, society, or whoever else) whenever they put some capital at risk. And my assertion is that such people are morons.
Understand the argument first before you respond to it.
cvj on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 6:28 pm
Benign0, who are these people who think ‘they are owed a profitable outcome whenever they put some capital at risk’ whom‘ you’re referring to?
The Ca t on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 6:51 pm
What you see are just the sales personnel who service the customers. What you do not see are the house detectives wearing street clothes and posing as customers.
The overhead cost of the Pinoy stores are mostly the salaries of the sales people. The overhead cost of the
Western retail stores include the salaries of the sales peoples, the house detectives and the humungous insurance against losses from theft thru shoplifting.
The Ca t on Fri, 25th Jan 2008 7:07 pm
You still believe this crap eh? Haven’t we argued on this before –not unless you still frequent the beauty counters where the sales personnel are taught how to apply make-up for demos.
The one or two staff in a Western department store would not bother to educate you about the products on they carry. They do not have the luxury to waste time on one customer. All the staff does is use the keyboard (which doesn’t require a brain of Einstein) to check the availability of the product item that you want to buy.
Most of them are also seasonal or on a part-time basis.
What’s the use of training them?
anthony scalia on Sat, 26th Jan 2008 10:17 pm
mlq3,
“As entrepreneurship is encouraged, so will an anti-union mentality”
Try being an owner-employer for a few years, and see if your views on unionism will stay the same.
Put yourself in the shoes of an owner-employer who couldn’t meet the orders of a prized overseas client on time because his workers are on strike.
cvj on Sun, 27th Jan 2008 2:53 am
Anthony, maybe that owner didn’t treat his workers well.
vic on Sun, 27th Jan 2008 12:19 pm
Magna International, One of the World’s Biggest Auto Parts Manufacturing expecting sales of $26B in a recession this year has no unionized labour force and is planning to organize. The President and CEO (the father)is against the Idea, but her daughter retiring MP Belinda Stronach is not against it..Ms Stronach who is retiring to return as CEO of the Co. had been running the company in the past and was quite successful..the employees reaction..Unions who made the Big 3 less competitive is not very attractive for a well-treated group of employees, though most unionized Public Employees and Publicly owned corporations here enjoy much, much better pension plans and benefits, some private concerns are very Wary because it may make bussiness less competitive and therby layoffs or worse even close shops…My bet they will reject the Plan of Organizing the Union…
Silent Waters on Sun, 27th Jan 2008 8:53 pm
CVJ
Hahaha. Didn’t treat his workers well my ass. My dad treated his workers very well, and still, they decided to form a union anyway because the KMU chuchus decided to influence them on the communist way fo thinking…which makes me wonder why you’re in capitalist SIngapore…you should be in CUba so you could see for yourself how communism really works….
Silent Waters on Sun, 27th Jan 2008 8:57 pm
The real problem is the false hopes these union leaders give these workers…they give them the notion that because they produce the goods, they should reap the most benefits….forgetting that somebody else put up the capital and the equipment in order to produce the goods…yan ang hirap sa inyong mga do gooders..porke yung mga capitalista, may pera na kasi, ang dapat pagbigyan na ;ang lagi, yung mga manggagawa. Kung ganun ng ganun lang, mawawala talaga ang mga manganaglakal sa Pilipinas. Tignan niyo na lang ang Valenzuela. Every yearm nagsasara ang mga pabrika. DI niyo man lamang iniisip na isa sa mga dahilan ay ang pagiging militante ng mga manggagawa. Sanakung productive. Hindi naman.
cvj on Sun, 27th Jan 2008 9:23 pm
Silent Waters, he’s your Dad so it’s natural you’d take his side. Besides, if he treated his workers well, how come he can’t convince them to stay loyal? There must be a breakdown in communication somewhere. Maybe he lacked empathy. BTW, unionization is not a communist idea. It is also practiced in Western Capitalist countries.
I wonder why businessmen don’t agree to deal with labor on equal terms. Hindi iyung parang alipin ang tingin. Government, labor and business should get together and have some give and take. Perhaps government should protect home grown businesses like yours, labor should avoid labor strike, while businessmen promise to keep their capital at home, i.e. avoiding capital strikes. Daanin sa magandang usapan.
Silent Waters on Sun, 27th Jan 2008 11:58 pm
CVJ
You really live in an ivory tower…..no wonder your ideas are so unbelievably utopian. Sorry…kaming mga nasa lupa, alam namin ang tunay na nangyayari. ANd sorry rin, I am not biased FOR my dad. We don;t see eye to eye on how to run a business but I know for a fact that he took care of his workers well. So Ikaw lang ang may problema, basta kapitalista, masama na. Basta unyonista, mabuting tao sila.
Silent Waters on Mon, 28th Jan 2008 12:01 am
you obviously looked at businessmen with biased eyes so there’s no point in having a discussion with you at all.
cvj on Mon, 28th Jan 2008 12:30 am
That’s a mischaracterization of what i said. Since when did a dialog between government, business and labor become utopian?
Silent Waters on Mon, 28th Jan 2008 7:19 am
Since I never heard anything spew out of your mouth other than businessmen being the source of evil in our country. Whenever somebody criticizes labor, you come up in their defense. Lahat nga kami, masama. Sorry, keep going back to the previous blog comments and read them yourself.
Silent Waters on Mon, 28th Jan 2008 7:38 am
ANd not only that. Whenever we make the slightest critique of the FIlipino labor’s character flaws, you come to their defense like they’re angels and can do no wrong. You never want to acknowledge that they have their share of the faults too. Responsibility should not be their concern. Yun ang mindset mo.
At least, ako, alam ko may mga problema rin ang mga businessman sa atin. I admit as much. Pero I don;t make blanket accusations the way you do. There is a presumption on your part that all businessmen are shady unless proven otherwise. At the same time, when labor is involved, they are all so innocent. Lagi silang pinagsasamantalahan ng negosyante. Hoy, each side have THEIR share of the problems.
And I never said there should’t be a dialog. I was just responding to your comment to Anthony. You presume immediately the workers weren’t treated well. hey, guess what, the workers at Nestle we’re given good salaries and benefits. Yet, they still went on strike. A Janitor who gets 25000 a month? That’s not being treated well. Jeezzz.
anthony scalia on Mon, 28th Jan 2008 10:19 am
cvj,
My point there is for commenters to see the big picture, before rushing immediately to labor’s side. More often than not, those who take the union point of view do not see the big picture.
While i don’t discount the reality of workers being oppressed, let us also not discount the reality that labor is not the innocent pristine creature leftists picture it to be.
And ‘taking care of his workers well’ is a very subjective idea. For the likes of KMU, owners never take care of their employees enough.
anthony scalia on Mon, 28th Jan 2008 10:30 am
Silent Waters,
Did you know that the brand name of leftist labor unions carry a big wallop?
How?
Lets say the workers of a company decide to form a union, and chooses to be affiliated with a leftist union. The company workers then apply for the conduct of an election with DOLE. If the company learns that their workers are affiliating with a known leftist union, it will panic (strikes all over)! And guess what? The leaders of that leftist union will offer to withdraw either the application for election or disaffiliate the company workers. For a fee.
Walang problema sa mga uring manggagawa. Ang tutoong problema ay ang mga leaders ng umbrella unions. Mga sulsulero. Pag nagsara ang pabrika, di naman magugutom ang mga leaders na ito, dahil di naman sila empleyado ng mga pabrikang nagsara.
cvj on Mon, 28th Jan 2008 2:08 pm
Lahat ba ng Tsinoy businessmen pusong mamon? BTW, what do you think should be the proper salary for janitors?
Anthony, if the KMU does that, then why don’t the employers get together and report their activities? Unfair practices by certain unions is not a basis for trying to eliminate them altogether. In the same way that businessmen not paying their proper taxes should not be a reason for altogether eliminating private enterprise.
anthony scalia on Mon, 28th Jan 2008 4:21 pm
cvj,
what can reporting do? those concerned will not bother. besides, that form of ‘extortion’ isn’t a crime, its the labor union equivalent of ‘greenmail’.
im not saying do away with unions. my point is that we should see the big picture, and acknowledge that both sides can be in pari delicto
cvj on Mon, 28th Jan 2008 4:35 pm
Anthony, that’s the price of apathy, i.e. the businessmen’s unwillingness to engage themselves in the public sphere.
anthony scalia on Mon, 28th Jan 2008 7:43 pm
cvj,
Businessmen have more profitable things to do than ‘report the matter to those concerned’. If a union isn’t formed, or if the union doesn’t affiliate with a leftist umbrella, that’s already more than enough consolation for him not to bother.
By the way, I have yet to hear you take issue with that so-prevalent practice of labor unions. You’re not faulting them for such ‘creative extortion’
cvj on Mon, 28th Jan 2008 8:02 pm
Anthony, there lies our own tragedy of the commons. We all know that everyone will benefit from a healthier public sphere that comes with greater public participation. However, businessmen choose to focus only on their own little concerns which is why corruption and dysfunctional practices persists. It’s that “don’t bother” attitude. There is little sense of belonging to a larger polity.
For the record, i condemn labor unions that engage in ‘creative extortion’.
Silent Waters on Mon, 28th Jan 2008 10:38 pm
CVJ
At long last, you see the big picture..like I said, I never claimed businessmen are pristine. What I am saying is that you should not just defend labor like they’re never at fault. At the end of the day, each side have their valid concerns and you are right that these should be discussed. I am only taking issue with your knee jerk defense of labor every time somebody bothers to critique their wrong behavior.
Now regarding your question on what should be the salary of a janitor, that is NOT the point of the argument. The point of the argument is that they still struck even if they’re one of the mroe highly paid workers in the Philippines, and in fact, higher than a lot of middle managers in most local companies. Now, you may argue that it certainly is not enough considering the talent. Then the problem goes back to the lack of jobs available, right? Supply and demand. We have too many college graduates running after too few jobs. So guess what, ganun talaga ang buhay.
Now, as for job creation, Anthony has some valid points about just shutting up and get into the mode of job creation rather than trying to keep on disrupting the political situation, thereby possibly causing distress on the economic front. Of course, one may argue the point that GMA is the cause of said instability, not the other way around. But then there are consitutional routes one can take. Pagalingan na lang yan. Eh kung magaling yung adminstrasyon mag-parry ng mga atake sa kanya, sorry, di ba? Ibig sabihin, mahina ang oposisyon.
Silent Waters on Mon, 28th Jan 2008 10:41 pm
Oh By the way, the BMP and the KMU are masters of creative extortion. This is from personal experience so don’t wonder why I have a very biased view against labor. I am not againts labor unions per se as it has it’s place in society. I do abhor labor unions as practiced in the Philippines. It’s only goal is to extort money from the businessmen by creating this class war between labor and capital.
That’s exactly my point as to why I told you to get down from your ivory tower and be down here, where its gets dirty so you’ll see how corrupt Philippine society is.
cvj on Mon, 28th Jan 2008 11:37 pm
Silent Waters, i don’t think its consistent for businessmen to lament how corrupt Philippine society is while taking advantage of that very same corruption.
anthony scalia on Tue, 29th Jan 2008 6:42 am
cvj,
There goes your presupposition on businessmen again.
If you’re a businessman who gave in to the creative extortion of a leftist umbrella, you’ll know the feeling of ‘don’t bother’.
A businessman knows he’ll profit more if he exercises self-restraint in the enjoyment of his freedoms under the Bill of Rights.
cvj on Tue, 29th Jan 2008 8:29 am
Anthony, which is why this is another tragedy of the commons. The businessman behaves in a way that may be good for him/her as an individual business but is harmful for the system, (including the business environment) as a whole.
benign0 on Tue, 29th Jan 2008 8:41 am
“So guess what, ganun talaga ang buhay” — Silent Waters
I think the above is the crux of the argument that Mr. cvj’s little mind simply fails to grasp. For him workers are OWED a fair treatment. In reality it is economics that is the ultimate scorekeeper.
While on the surface it seems that a “just” employee-employer relationship was worked out to varying degrees of success in most advanced societies, the truth is that this relationship for the most part EVOLVED just like any other social contract (some game theorists worked out a theory to model this evolution). What we see today is a snapshot of that evolution (it is still on-going and will most likely still continue to change). It didn’t come about out of some altruistic objectives in either party. It simply evolved to fit the economic environment — supply/demand, politics, etc.
Ganun talaga buhay. Just as the wondrous variety of life we see today is but a mere snapshot of a walang-personalan and no-good-intentions-meant evolution process, that social contract between worker and employer we see today (regardless of how dysfunctional, unjust, or generally not nice we perceive it to be) is how things turn out given the environment we find ourselves in.
The reality is a far cry from Mr. cvj peachy La-La Land of heroic union leaders and cringingly benevolent owners of business enterprise.
Silent Waters on Tue, 29th Jan 2008 9:10 am
CVJ
Sadly, you still don’t get it do you…akala ko pa naman, magaling ka…DIDN’T YOU SEE WHAT I JUST SAID A FEW COMMENTS AGO…BOTH SIDES HAVE THEIR SHARE OF THE BLAME. ANg hina mo pala. Ang problema ko talaga sa iyo, one sided ka. Ako at least, I see both sides having the problem. Ikaw, the masses have NO BLAME.
Silent Waters on Tue, 29th Jan 2008 9:15 am
Benigno
I have friends from all political colors and guess what, the stuff CVJ espouses is basically a very left leaning, almost communistic utopia. I have had long discussions with them on this. I always ask one simple question…how does one control the human instinct? It is instinctive for us to improve ourselves as individuals (unfortuantely, sometimes at the expense of others). Ang problema ko sa gusto ni CVJ, gusto niya, lahat maging robot. Ang running assumption niya, everybody has goodness in their hearts. Kaya nga, I’ve been telling him to get his head of the ivory tower. (tuloy akala niya nasa heaven na siya.:-) )
benign0 on Tue, 29th Jan 2008 9:44 am
Silent Waters,
That’s the problem with ideologies (across the entire spectrum) and people who delegate their thinking faculties to these (instead of, well, THINKING for themselves).
The biggest mistake is assuming that coercion, inlfuence, or even force will mold people’s mind into an ideal that will make the system espoused by an ideology work.
So far only organised religion managed to succeed in the area of mind control on a massive scale. Although as we are seeing today, wider-spread application of critical thought is also stripping that power from religion (this is not to say that organised religion is not going away without a mighty fight).
Unfortunately the idea that people’s thinking processes can be changed to make an ideology work dominated history and resulted in the catastrophic loss of life in various wars and revolutions.
Human instinct (mostly geared towards self-serving purposes) evolved over millions of years. Ideologies, on the other hand, have been around only for thousands.
So which of the two will prevail?
For most people the answer to that question is a no-brainer. But for many small-minded ideologues like you-know-who, the reality merely escapes them.
Silent Waters on Tue, 29th Jan 2008 11:45 am
Benigno
No wonder he has no qualms about exterminating the “rich” and the “elites”. He thinks nobody will replace them as the people who are left behind (the poor and the downtrodden) are so nice and have everybody’s interest at heart that Utopia is at hand….wink wink
anthony scalia on Tue, 29th Jan 2008 4:01 pm
cvj,
my goodness! a simple but lawful and rightful choice not to bother is already harmful to the system?!?
in case you haven’t noticed, you’re not faulting the acts of the creative extortionists, but you’re blaming the omissions of businessmen!
Paul on Tue, 29th Jan 2008 5:00 pm
Interesting debate.
The positions of business organizations on labor and social issues, as well as on corruption, are a matter of public record.
True, a businessman can choose to complain but will time stand still by doing so?
cvj on Tue, 29th Jan 2008 5:12 pm
In a just society, everybody whether rich or poor should be treated fairly. I’m astounded that i have to state something that’s supposed to be part of basic human decency. The logic of the market is not a substitute, nor is it an excuse for not doing the right thing. Even Adam Smith did not endorse such behavior.
Silent Waters, i don’t think the masa is blameless but you cannot point to their faults to excuse your own. That’s childish.
Anthony, it’s not a matter of just doing what’s within the law. There’s such a thing as civic responsibility. If you keep silent in the face of extortion, then the culprits will naturally get away with it. The businessmen are paying the price of apathy. And it’s not right to fix a mistake with another mistake, e.g. suppressing the legitimate right of labor to strike.
cvj on Tue, 29th Jan 2008 5:15 pm
Paul, time stands still for no one but businessmen nevertheless have to take the long view. I thought that’s what entrepreneurs are supposed to be good at?
Silent Waters on Tue, 29th Jan 2008 8:53 pm
CVJ
I am not trying to excuse the businessmen….I never indicated that at all. I am miffed at your defense of labor as if they’re blameless. I am not the only one to notice this as Benigno and Scalia noticed it too. That’s what we’re trying to point out. NOBODY IS BLAMELESS. Each have their faults.
It is only NOW that you have said explicitly that the masa is not blameless. BUT, I never used your defense of the masa as an excuse for the businessmen to do their shenanigans. Ikaw lang ang nag isip nun…maybe to parry my arguments?
Silent Waters on Tue, 29th Jan 2008 8:59 pm
Now regarding apathy, it’s a choice whether one wants to do something or not, di ba? Why is it that you insists that others should fix the problem but when it comes to aksing you to go home and fix the problem, you don’t do it? Bakit pag ibang tao, di gumalaw, sermon ang aabutin namin sa iyo pero kung ikaw ang sinabihang umuwi at mag lead sa mga kasamahan ninyo para maayos ang ating lipunan, deadma ka lang? Eh di pa apathy rin yun? Ang tawag sa ganun, kibitzing lang.
cvj on Tue, 29th Jan 2008 11:59 pm
Silent Waters, i’m not saying that you do not have a choice (to be or not to be apathetic). What i’m pointing out is that apathy is the wrong choice.
Individually, businessmen who take a don’t bother attitude may be better off because they can spend more time in their respective businesses. Collectively, [almost] everyone is worst off because the system remains corrupt and dysfunctional. It’s a society-wide failure of cooperation.
benign0 on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 6:37 am
“Individually, businessmen who take a don’t bother attitude may be better off because they can spend more time in their respective businesses. Collectively, [almost] everyone is worst off because the system remains corrupt and dysfunctional. It’s a society-wide failure of cooperation.”
Nice change of heart (although it is difficult to debate with people who move their goalposts as often as you do).
So now it is a society-wide “failure of cooperation”? That is to say the least a nonsensical concept.
“Failure of cooperation” implies that you still see “cooperation” as an expected SENTIMENT of a population rather than as an EMERGENT property of said population brought about by some kind of coming together of environmental factors not directly attributable to any one person or party’s sentiment.
Your expectation that a society “successfully cooperate” (and become an opposite of your bizarre concept “failure of cooperation”), the argument still seems to lead to this expectation of some kind of altruistic behaviour amongst elements of said population rather than it being an outcome of the collective dynamic of said population.
Still the ideologue unfortunately.
Silent Waters on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 8:38 am
Methinks CVJ really wants a communist state in our midst. That’s the only way one gets cooperation from the poulation don’t you think? He really lives in an IVORY TOWER.
benign0 on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 8:45 am
“Methinks CVJ really wants a communist state in our midst. That’s the only way one gets cooperation from the poulation don’t you think? He really lives in an IVORY TOWER”
The irony there (which apparently is lost to him) is that he has a huge beef against elitism!
anthony scalia on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 9:29 am
cvj,
Again, I have yet to hear you find fault with the creative extortionists. I hear your solution to the problem lies in the hands of the ‘extortioned’ businessmen. Not with labor policing their own ranks, as these creative extortionists give labor a very bad name.
Aren’t you noticing my friend – you are acknowledging the wide-scale damage caused by these creative extortionists, and yet your prescribed solution is for the victims to report their activities?!? Not even a hint of self-regulation on the part of labor?
why don’t you hold these creative extortionists accountable in the same way you want government officials accountable to the people?
and whoa, hold a second, you’re assuming something, my friend, that I am for suppressing the legitimate right of labor to strike. ****sound of buzzer**** Wrong.
May i remind you also that strike is also a legitimate form of bargaining leverage?
The right is there, but it doesn’t mean you have to exercise it.
How many labor-intensive companies have closed shop, thanks to the unwise exercise of this legitimate right to strike? But oh there’s a consolation – the enjoyment of exercising a legitimate right. The loss of a means of livelihood doesn’t matter; the exercise of a legitimate right is.
Silent Waters on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 10:29 am
Anthony
CVJ doesn’t want to admit it, but he’s really JOMA SISON. Kunwari nasa Netherlands pero actually nasa Singapore lang.
Yun nga ang lagi kong nakikitang problema kay CVJ, ang may kasalanan ng lahat, negosyante. Kapag palpak ang labor (e.g. creative extortionist) deadma lang siya.
Motherhood statements like two wrongs don’t make a right don’t cut it in this world. We live in a world where there’s a lot of shades of gray. Sa kanya, black and white lang lahat, as if all decisions can only have pros or cons.
Di ko alam tuloy kung saan talaga nakatira yung tao. He enjoys the fruits of a democratic life but condemns the reason why there is such a life. Only in being able to do business and innovate is there improvement in human life. Di yung command economy na gusto niyang impose sa lahat. (Baka gusto niya kasi maging leader nun? Shades of JOMA talaga).
Silent Waters on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 10:40 am
I am sure he will rebut your argument by saying it’s the businessman’s fault that he closed shop. Kung pakiramdam niya di kumikita eh? That’s going to be his argument. What he doesn’t even realize that productivity is important and sad to say, the productivity of labor in the Philippines (at least in manufacturing except for a few companies) suck.
Gusto ni CVJ, reward mo muna ang labor bago sila gagalaw. and in fact, kung puede nga, di sila gumalaw, mas ok! Then he wonders why businessmen have a hard time making manufacturing work in Manila and prefer smuggling na lang. Trading requires less people and you need to deal with less headaches.
Why do you think China is productive? Is it because they’re paid less? NOOOO! They’re productive because even if the total pay (including benefits of food and housing) of labor in China is at par with the Philippines, they produce more per worker! Tapos nagtataka siya bakit China is growing fast.
And speaking of pay in China, since the pay is at par with the Philippines, why doesn’t he condemn it anyway. Or baka naman di niya pupumanahin kasi China yun, communist party. Am sure a cop out statement like,why should we care about china since this is a Philippine blog will be par for the course.
Hanggang ngayon, he never answered why he doesn’t just come home and help in making the Philippines a better place if he really has the country’s interest at heart. Hindi yung kibitz lang nang kibitz. Pukol lang ng pukol, wala naman gagawin.
haaaayyy…
anthony scalia on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 10:42 am
Silent Waters,
as per his posts, he works in Singapore, holding an upper management position.
he can’t externalize his pro-labor views there, kaya dito na lang niya ginagawa yun. walang mga union dun.
which makes me wonder – isn’t he enjoying to the max the no-union, no-strike, no-picket, no-CBA negotiating life there?
or maybe he still clings to the activist notion that labor is as innocent as a child
anthony scalia on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 10:47 am
Silent Waters,
for sure cvj will not agree to the idea that “a wage increase that is not tied to productivity is a big no-no”
cvj on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 11:53 am
Benign0, just to clarify, it is not, as you mention, a “change of heart” since that is what i was saying from the beginning. Scroll up to my preceding comments (January 28th, 2008 at 8:02 pm and January 29th, 2008 at 8:29 am) where i mentioned our own tragedy of the commons.
I also subscribe to the basic tenet of economic thought that people respond to incentives and recognize that it is the aggregate of such responses [to price signals] that make up the market system. However, we are not animals who can only see the meal in front of us. In fact, the ability to filter incentives is the the same habit of thought that entrepreneurs exercise when they forego present consumption to invest in future production. It only takes them to expand that mindset to cover political and social sphere, they will realize that what you denigrate as altruism is actually enlightened self-interest.
cvj on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 12:03 pm
I would like to refer you to the second paragraph of one of my earlier comments in this thread (at January 27th, 2008,9:23 pm) where i said…Government, labor and business should get together and have some give and take. Perhaps government should protect home grown businesses like yours, labor should avoid labor strike, while businessmen promise to keep their capital at home, i.e. avoiding capital strikes. Daanin sa magandang usapan.
Doesn’t that qualify as a hint?
Silent Waters on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 12:08 pm
Anthony
I am just actually surprised that considering his upper management position in Singapore, you would think he would be less of an ideologue in the mold of the activists in Manila and be able to see more of the big picture..that the world DOES NOT OWE YOU ANYTHING. It’s up to us to take our place in the world. Whether rich or poor, white, yellow, brown or black, it’s doesn’t matter.
It seems to me he just wants to have his cake and eat it too. Kapag naayos na natin ang bansa natin. Dun na lanag ako uuwi at tutulong. How pathetic. Sarap pala ng buhay sa Singapore.
cvj on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 12:19 pm
Siletn Waters, i’m not upper management.
Silent Waters on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 12:35 pm
I stand corrected…just got the info from Anthony…
leah on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 12:36 pm
the Star does not archive, so please post entire article when its the Star
cvj on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 1:19 pm
Thanks Silent Waters. While we’re at it, i’m also not communist. (If i were, i won’t deny it, but i don’t think i qualify as one.)
Silent Waters on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 2:17 pm
CVJ
Well, even if you aren’t, your arguments seems to veer towards the communist ideals (the pure version)
anthony scalia on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 3:20 pm
Silent Waters,
Sorry about that. i remember in one of his posts elsewhere in this blog cvj said that he is leading a multinational team. I thought at the minimum he’s a project or team manager. If not upper management, middle management
anthony scalia on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 3:30 pm
cvj,
No, because its way too general. A broad statement covering all sectors. You’re playing it safe. There’s no mention of labor checking the excesses (like creative extortion) of its peers.
You’re always pointing out the wrong ways of businessmen. Why not single out labor for a change? Even just a hint of recommending self-regulation, but single out labor. Please
cvj on Wed, 30th Jan 2008 7:25 pm
Anthony, ok i agree. Labor should make an effort to regulate its own ranks of those who threaten to strike for the purpose of extorting money from businessmen.
UP n student on Tue, 1st Apr 2008 11:12 pm
TEST ONLY:
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