My choice
September 20, 2008 by mlq3
Filed under Daily Dose
And who knows, if you read and respond to this before midnight, tonight, Philippine time, it could be yours, too.
My choice for Bloggers’ Choice Award in the Philippine Blog Awards, is the collective known as Filipino Voices.
The variety of voices, the breadth (and depth) of the commentary on the site, and the collective representing the most successful and enduring effort to bring the voices of ordinary citizens to the fore, deserves admiration -and recognition by their peers in the blogosphere.
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leytenian on Sat, 20th Sep 2008 10:00 pm
yeah, filipino voices offers a variety of topics. But this blog has not reached the majority of the provinces to share their opinions not because they don’t want to but due to technological limitation to access. Manolo’s previous blog however has about 620 comments. 90% of the commenters are the “know it all type of people” and I agree… lol
jcc on Sat, 20th Sep 2008 10:09 pm
MLQ3,
My last post under the last update was that your blog has attacted a conumdrum of voices, mostly elitist in thought. The Filipino people is not involved in your blog unless we claim that we represent them which is hardly the truth.
jcc on Sat, 20th Sep 2008 10:17 pm
i cannot figure out what the photo is. is this a blade server, an air conditioner or a multi-stack cisco switch?
BrianB on Sun, 21st Sep 2008 1:52 am
Some very smart people are voting Mike Villar: http://www.mikevillar.com/
They have made this video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8WgZP6LaPjc
BrianB on Sun, 21st Sep 2008 1:57 am
Correction. Only one Pau made the youtube video above.
UP n student on Sun, 21st Sep 2008 2:44 am
BrianB on Sun, 21st Sep 2008 2:51 am
Who’s bikoy? And how do you know these people?
hvrds on Sun, 21st Sep 2008 10:52 am
A collective representing many thoughts over individual thoughts should be number 1. My vote for Filipino voices. No contest
Side bar:
Individual perceptions based on class contradictions actually speak more about limbic perceptions than anything else.
Higher brain functions almost totally missing.
We have to keep battling those limbic tendencies through higher brain functions.
KG on Sun, 21st Sep 2008 11:15 am
Ng tumagal nga iyong previous blog thread mo,nandun ako sa FV. buti nga bago na ang entry na ito eh.
And sa totoo lang nadining ko lang yung FV nung may blog tunglol ke benign0 dito.
Leytenian,
madami ka ding comments sa previous thread,are you saying that you are a know it all type??
UP n student on Sun, 21st Sep 2008 12:41 pm
bikoy was from Ateneo high school, then he got BS MassComm from Diliman. He still is at UP-Diliman, now taking law.
Bikoy or mikevillar (younger audience) winning the blog award over FilipinoVoices (older audience) will give some indication of the demographics of Pinas internet crowd.
BrianB on Sun, 21st Sep 2008 2:38 pm
Blame Bikoy’s network of friends if he wins and blame the posters of Filipino Voices for failing to promote the blog.
BrianB on Sun, 21st Sep 2008 2:48 pm
Isn’t there a controversial senate bill from another Villar that needs seeking teeth into?
rego on Sun, 21st Sep 2008 3:13 pm
“katulad din yan ng adovcaies mo at ng mag kasamahan pagtdating sa kabulukan sa pinas eh. l. maganda naman talaga. pero mau nakikinig ba o may napabago ka bang mga tao na nsa kanila dito sa blog maliban doon sa mga datin mo nag kasamahan. wla eh. ang paga aasta mo kasi dito eh its soooo assholic at masyadong pa “holier than than thou†eh. so sino naman ang ganahan lumipat sa side nyo. ;=)†rego
Well, compare to your posts and comments (which I don’t bother to read because of either wrong spelling or just blabbering incoherently for the most part). Mapatagalog or english mali parin…duh
My first post, though I’ve been reading mlq3’s blogs more than a year now. I just can’t ignore your self righteous way of shooting commenters. Lumalabas na mas mayabang ka pa nga eh. At least si hrvds may ipagyayabang..Mga post mo wala namang substance.
mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
…………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………. no wonder why hvdrs said tanga tlalaga ang pinoy!!!
Hey cvj tatlong marks lamg ya huh
KG on Sun, 21st Sep 2008 4:26 pm
UPN,
mukhang mukhang dapat di UP n student ang tawag mo sa sarili mo.
pang admissions office at registrar na yung pinakita mo eh
==========================================
jcc, magkakasundo kayo ni cvj kahit isang beses sa comment mong ito.
“My last post under the last update was that your blog has attacted a conumdrum of voices, mostly elitist in thought. The Filipino people is not involved in your blog unless we claim that we represent them which is hardly the truth.”
anthony scalia on Sun, 21st Sep 2008 4:43 pm
i guess he’s the 123,456,789th Rising Internet Star
UP n student on Sun, 21st Sep 2008 7:42 pm
BryanBoy being a Bloggers Award judg is a reminder that the mikevillar or bikoy topics have a following.
And no one nominated luwaran-dot-com. No one interested?
Master Yoda on Sun, 21st Sep 2008 8:15 pm
I totally agree with Manolo’s endorsement of Filipino Voices for the bloggers’ choice award.
We also do it here in this blog (varied comments and off-topics) but Filipino Voices could be said as the equivalent of multi-tasking, one-stop shop, and multi-level marketing. With a wide array of themes, viewpoints, and the multitude of reactions and comments, FV offers many possibilities.
But here in mlq3’s blog, I’ve observed the presence of quite loyal commenters that have in a way formed a bond, good or bad, I don’t know?
‘Di baleng medyo original, basta nagkukuwentuhan lang tayo. ‘
BrianB on Sun, 21st Sep 2008 9:44 pm
Market Manila won, which means there is a possibility big business will be interested in putting money on sites like blogs. My guess.
fried-neurons on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 3:35 am
Huh? How do the dots connect? MarketManila is not a commercial site, accepts absolutely no advertising, and is openly hostile to overtures for paid editorials…
nash on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 3:59 am
I didn’t get the UPCAT joke.
Diba multiple choice exam lang yun?
nash on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 4:03 am
“I’ve observed the presence of quite loyal commenters that have in a way formed a bond, good or bad, I don’t know?”
Siguro.
I’m quite violent (but I’m used kasi to openly insulting my friends) but I also like the matatarays like The Cat dahil marami ako natututunan sa kanya kahit on other items I cannot agree. I like the sarcastic ones, they should post more often in the comments dahil sila usually yung may original dvd yung iba naglalagay lang ng google search results nila na parang pirated copy.
BrianB on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 4:18 am
Market Manila is as middle class as they come. Imagine if a political blog or mikevillar won, what would the corporations think?
nash on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 4:54 am
whois mikevillar?
Marketman on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 9:48 am
Hello, earth to commenters, what planet are we on? I don’t think I won anything this year… I actually caught a few seconds of the Philippine Blog Awards on the Ustream when working, and I think “Batang Yagit” won the Blogger’s Choice Award for 2008. Marketmanila.com won it last year, 2007 Blogger’s Choice Award. And there isn’t a list of all the winner up yet anywhere in the net as of this posting, so isn’t it bizarre that a blog awards hasn’t bothered to blog about its winners soon afterwards? So BrianB, if a middle class blog such as mine didn’t win it, and neither did a political one or a mikevillar one, then what will advertisers have to say about that??? And thank you fried neurons, for describing me as being “openly hostile to overtures to paid editorials” — that is so me.
Rodolfo on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 10:10 am
atheista dot net ? ? ?
some one posted that the page below contains list of winners (but word of warning . . . lots of errors or lies or half-truths in various websites of the World Wide Web ) :
http://www.itot54joni.com/2008/09/philippine-blog-awards-list-of-winners.html
hvrds on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 12:06 pm
The first two limbic pundits on this particular thread said something interesting about representation.
The state is in the process of saving the capital of the richest few in the United States.
That means the people’s collective savings will be saving them The so very few screwed up badly and royally. But they in the end will be saved and their capital preserved….
THAT WILL BE ‘KUNO’ FOR THE COMMON GOOD…
Is that democracy at work or what?????
mlq3 on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 1:28 pm
winners here:
http://jesterinexile.blogspot.com/2008/09/roll-of-honor-of-2008-philippine-blog.html
and:
http://www.philippineblogawards.com.ph/2008/09/21/the-winners-of-the-2008-philippine-blog-awards/
BrianB on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 2:02 pm
Wtf, saw the results posted somewhere. UP n, double check, Bikoy.net is not mikevillar.
nash on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 5:36 pm
@hvrds
very astute. the irony is lost on your limbic friends i suppose.
UP n grad on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 5:45 pm
hindi ba iyong AIG bailout is saving the bathwater along with the baby ?
[ grad na ang gagamitin ko, di na student ]
leytenian on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 7:35 pm
The AIG bailout is a good deal that the government has done. $85 bridge loan collateralized with trillion dollar AIG assets, that’s extraordinary. It’s almost like buying a foreclose home of $ 50,000 which is actually worth $300,000. I could sell it right away to overseas investors at $ 120,000. I’m sure the government will clean it up a little bit. Hire new CEO’s , breakdown its holdings and sell it to private entities or wealthy individual.
nash on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 8:03 pm
a good deal to nationalise bad debts?
tapos you complain about the ‘lazy’ welfare cheats but this bail out is a good thing????
hokey.
now paulson wants other central banks to do the same. ano siya, hilo?
jcc on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 8:26 pm
“The AIG bailout is a good deal that the government has done. $85 bridge loan collateralized with trillion dollar AIG assets, that’s extraordinary. It’s almost like buying a foreclose home of $ 50,000 which is actually worth $300,000. I could sell it right away to overseas investors at $ 120,000. I’m sure the government will clean it up a little bit. Hire new CEO’s , breakdown its holdings and sell it to private entities or wealthy individual. – leytenian…
I agree.. but other people see something wrong with the bailout. The same people will see something wrong if the feds did not bail out AIG at all… People will ascribe ill-motive, such as bailing out the rich people with the poor people’s money… but the feds sees it as saving the poor investment from total catastrophe.. They will not look into your position that the Feds make a good bargain/decision in taking over the AIG, fired the voracious CEOS and let the regulators run the company…
From my standpoint, taking over a failed private company to prevent wholesale economic chaos is what a responsible government should do, unless one would to see chaos in the U.S. economy which incidentally, would even impact third world countries, one of which is P.I.
BrianB on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 9:46 pm
eh ano ang n?
cvj on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 10:04 pm
Very apt analogy.
cvj on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 10:35 pm
It’s supposed to be just a comedy skit, but this this video clip is tracking reality quite well…
That’s reality.
BrianB on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 10:49 pm
Sabi ko na nga eh buwagin na yang market na yan. Wala pang taong magugutom.
jcc on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 10:56 pm
i like pundits on this blog who call everyone stupid or in limbic clouds because you have a different take than them…
despite the present millineum, no country has ever devised an ideal democratic process whereby in time of crisis the government goes back to the people for consultation and ask for referendum on the planned action on an impending crisis..
Every government has so called emergency powers. The determination of whether the exercice of that power was called under the circumstances is never left to the people but to the institution and the people must act through that institution
in the case of AIG bailout, the federal government has so acted pursuant to that legal duty… there is no mechanism in place which requires the Feds to ask for a referendum so the “people” will have a say on what to do with the impending economic crisis.
it is like offering a referendum on whether the U.S. has to undertake a pre-emptive strike on a country determined to be inimical to her best interest.
Unfortunately, the political geniuses of the past era and under our time are quite happy with the concept that a representative government can act through their elected leaders and the curtailment of abuse is limited only to the people being able to boot them out of office on election day. That is democracy enought for me. Other means would be risky if it would not result to outright anarchy.
cvj on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 11:23 pm
Brian (at 10:49 pm), repudiating the market would mean repeating the mistake of the communist countries which, after all, collapsed much earlier (in 1989). Now its the turn of free market capitalism to collapse from its excesses. We need to develop a healthy respect for both Markets and Hierarchies (yes, that includes government) while being aware of its limits.
BrianB on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 11:36 pm
Problem is personal greed whether for money or power always gets in the way of a good idea. Transparency and more “respect” for the “crowd” as that bestselling book calls “the people.” Next time.
BrianB on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 11:43 pm
“Individual perceptions based on class contradictions actually speak more about limbic perceptions than anything else.
Higher brain functions almost totally missing.
We have to keep battling those limbic tendencies through higher brain functions.”
We operate via groups. Advocacies are necessarily prejudicial to its opponents and they are “limbic” driven. Imagine using your higher brain functions on every personal decision, you would hardly move from your seat. Besides, you’ll need to have the power of mind control; otherwise it’s emotions and broad analyses that get the most votes.
PSI on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 11:43 pm
cvj,
Further to our earlier discussions on market vs. government failure, the U.S. (and now global) financial meltdown is what is really is a market failure.
There was adequate (?) government regulation in the sense that the central banks knew what was going on (sub-prime mortgages, securitization, hedge funds, credit default swaps, ec)) but possibly did not realize the breadth and depth of it.
Or maybe so trusted the market to regulate itself.
BrianB on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 11:44 pm
post above for hvrds.
The Ca t on Mon, 22nd Sep 2008 11:53 pm
Mlq3
One blogger posted in one blog that you are one the judges in the recently held Phil. Blogging Awards. I checked the Pba website, indeed you are in the ist.
I like Filipino Voices but isn’t it irregular for a judge to endorse or promote a particular blog he likes?
.
cvj on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 1:11 am
PSI, in his defense of the free market, the economist Friedrich Hayek said that the market is the most efficient way to transmit and receive information about supply and demand in the form of prices. That’s why economies with communist governments which relied on central planning suffered shortages or overcapacity. I agree with him especially as he was vindicated by the collapse of communism in 1989.
Unfortunately, just as governments can fail, markets can likewise do so. In the case of financial markets, this information coordination mechanism failed because of the way the incentives among the actors were structured (i.e. lenders being compensated for quantity of loans rather than quality). Moreover, the process of aggregating and repackaging and reselling these loans (i.e. ’securitization’) which are then given ratings by the credit rating agencies resulted in loss of information about the true quality of these financial instruments.
Market failure in this case is therefore synonymous with the breakdown in the collection and transmission of information. And where the market fails in this function, there is no choice but for government (or maybe NGO’s) to step in.
BTW, addressing market failure (in terms of discovering and coordinating information) is also the reason why governments have to formulate and carry out (together with the private sector) industrial policy especially in developing countries.
UP n grad on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 1:48 am
Information was flowing.
Te evildoers
— the shorts — had done their homework and “knew” enough to be betting against the Lehman’s and AIG’s who had overstepped.
And yes, there were other financiers — the Leucadia’s and the Warren Buffetts and the Phil Gross’s — whose conservative bents (either “natural” to their persona or imposed by the nature of their incorporation papers) who dared not ……. go where no one has been before playing fast and aggressive with (in leytenian’s words) other people’s money.
cvj on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 2:14 am
UPn, the ’shorts’ entered late in the game. It was information loss that generated the bubble in the first place.
UP n grad on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 2:27 am
cvj: I don’t know what you mean by late in the game but shorts (especially naked-shorts) are naturally slow. One should place “against”-bets only AFTER the excesses have become evident (based on the accounting methodology of the shorts).
The natural tendency of a stock-price is up because “the market” assumes that corporation-management knows what they are doing AND that “good management” result in a rising stock-price.
cvj on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 2:44 am
UPn, ‘late in the game’ means just that. By the time the subprime market collapsed, financial institutions had major exposures. It was more like a pyramid scam rather than a properly functioning market.
I’m not aware that there is a ‘natural tendency’ for stock prices. Believing that there is such a tendency may have contributed to the bubble. Besides, we both have spent decades in the corporate sector so don’t you think that assuming ‘good management’ because ‘corporation-management knows what they are doing’ is naive?
BrianB on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 3:21 am
cvj,
information loss is intentional, isn’t it. It’s what drives the market in the first place. Most stock markets are overpriced, some way overpriced especially in europe and south america.
How many times do people have to explain to other people that the market is psychology driven. What do they think it means? It’s this premise of greed that made this all happen. People are greedy yes, but do markets and corporate wealth have to ride on this greed? They should be forced to be more rational. Then maybe this could end world hunger.
BrianB on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 3:49 am
Alittle closer to home:
http://www.malaya.com.ph/sep22/busi8.htm
via uniffors
nash on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 4:52 am
I’d agree with some of BrianB’s points.
This is why economics is largely psychology. No one is ever correct and it’s not an exact science. Kaya nga walang nobel prize for economics.
It’s hard to rein in on greed especially in this consumerist society we live in. Kaya nga kahit yung mga sinasabing medyo ‘intelligent’ naloloko pa rin ng pyramid schemes. They know that there is no way you can get a 75% roi on such ventures but they still put their money in. It’s irrational and can only be greed.
When Lehman collapsed, what did the bankers do? They as much as they can on their canteen cards! This is one reason why no one is really sympathetic to bankers who lose their jobs.
UP n grad on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 5:00 am
So what is Senator Alan Cayetano saying — that it is wrong to investigate Villar’s C-5 road controversy because the questions are only meant to embarass Villar’s 2010 presidential bid?
nash on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 5:22 am
whut???? is that what cayetano really said?
did he drink chinese milk fortified with melamine too?
super walang kwenta pala yang senator na yan with that logic.
hvrds on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 5:34 am
I think it was Jefferson who said it most succinctly that democracy is not about the majority but it is about the majority who participate.
Even then he and the leading thought leaders then also wanted to put basic chains on the tendency of men’s limbic propensities with written declarations of what they considered natural law…
We hold these truths to be self-evident.. Emphasis on the words self-evident. Those declarations then became the basis for the Basic law.
Jefferson however was furious after the constitutional convention because the issue of slavery was left on hold to get the Southern colonies on board. In politics one has to compromise.
The theory of democracy is based on all participating in the decision making.
In practice it is actually through representatives.
The degree of representative government varies.
From centralized democracies like China to broad based multilevel representative based governments.
While China is ruled by one party state. The U.S. is ruled by an implicit capitalist party. The division between the capitalist party is the two party system.
But they are owners of production nevertheless.
Since time immemorial the one who could bring home the bacon ruled the roost. In feudal times it became the merchant class and landlords who supported the king.
Bottom line it is the working class that always will pay the price.
One of the most important breakthroughs in the last century is the rapid evolution of the technology of communication. Digital revolution has brought down and collapsed the price of communication on many levels.
Look at the tittle of this thread. Is it about fame or fortune or both in deciding the best blog…Or is it something more??????
Ones perspective will depend on ones level of awareness. Separating the self from the mind takes a lot of work…
The name Mahatma means Great Soul.
The name Pandit from which pundit is derived means the Learned One. Pandit Nehru and Ali Jinnah were two of the most Learned minds leading India in the most turbulent of times.
It was the Great Soul who saw past these learned minds.
Gandhi through most of his life had to learn how to control his limbic mind. Non-violence he said.
Learn to control your mind that if a man strikes you do not stirke back… Let him feel your pain…
Off course that is way beyond most mortals including myself.
Politics and financial markets are primordially based on two most basic of instincts – fear and greed. The rational mind should always be in charge.
Today that fear has permeated even the most learned of men… They can feel it, touch it and even taste it.
But the bottom line is still this… How does one regulate instincts without chaining down the entire mind which is integrated between high and lower brain functions. We need the limbic region to drive us with the higher brain at the controls.
Jefferson said that now and then you should keep the regulators in check by destroying them. They should be always be reminded that the people rule…
So remember that those who remain silent give their assent by silence to the status quo. Those that particpate and seize the moment will always rule by fair and foul means.
We deserve the system we get all the time…Maraming pang Pinoy ay tanga kaysa sa hindi.
Pero may kaunting mag tao ay unti unti ay gumigising. Malaking bagay ang mga bloging community.
Someone said recently that the U.S. revolution was founded on the writings of the learned ones who were after all community organizers…
My most esteemed congratulations once again to MLQ3 and the people who conceptualized FV….
But you still need greed to fund the organizing. I do wish the extreme left would recognize that you cannot socialize tuyo…
“I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs.”
Thomas Jefferson, Letter to the Secretary of the Treasury Albert Gallatin (1802)
3rd president of US (1743 – 1826
leytenian on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 6:51 am
The government knew all along that AIG was in trouble and that Fannie/Freddie and Lehman were at their doorstep as well. The government has to choose which entity can be saved and let go. AIG has to be assisted for the sake of everyone around the world.
AIG needed $70 billion to meet funding requirements but its’ not that much compared to AIG’s core insurance companies.
Now, suppose that you are a wealthy independent multi-trillionaire. Would you lend $70 billion to AIG at 10% secured by whatever you could and with an attached option to buy 60% of AIG at present value?
It’s a good deal. I think you would.
The only trillionaire is the US government.
The future value of this investment may swing positively financially but politically ?
Present Value is 60% off current stock price. ( AIG profits $20 billion a year )
Initial Investment of $ 70 billion at 10% return. Calculate future value in 3 years. Both scenario … just for fun.
leytenian on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 7:01 am
the 10% required rate of return is only an example but there’s what the US government is expecting.
“The U.S. government will receive a 79.9% stake in the insurance company, with the power to eliminate dividends.
The loan would be repaid by the asset sale.
The AIG facility has a 24-month term. Interest will accrue on the outstanding balance at a rate of three-month Libor plus 850 basis points. ”
please do not calculate LIBOR rate plus 850 basis points, hvrds will not get it. It will take one semester for The cat to explain…
ON The limbic system :” Being a concept grounded more in tradition than in facts, many scientists have suggested that the concept be abandoned.”
Hi hvrds… lol
leytenian on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 7:30 am
honestly, the libic system of pinoys apply to this link…
http://www.mefeedia.com/entry/charice-celine-dion-duet-on-oprah-sept-19-2008/11601324/
UP n grad on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 7:30 am
to leytenian: of course, you know that the sovereign funds (of China, Saudi, Hongkong, Singapore) didn’t look too kindly on buying-at-huge-discount the AIG papers.
benign0 on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 7:39 am
Just a reminder to all that Pinoys, being slow learners and slow thinkers, need a big headstart in the effort to think about what’s gonna happen in the next elections.
This video is a good place to start and reflect:
Philippine Presidential Elections
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ZCMn3USk6w
I might also recommend this slideshow that makes a rather bumpy journey towards a more enlightened view of the true dysfunction that underpins Pinoy society and how this dysfunction imprisons us in an never-ending cycle of electing the same morons to public office:
Why Filipinos suck at democracy
http://www.getrealphilippines.com/sh01/slide01.html
Pause.
Reflect.
Think.
-
leytenian on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 7:39 am
true UP N but it’s better than bankruptcy
BrianB on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 7:46 am
hvrds,
Just want to address one thing in your argument, that is, present an opposing view to this.
“Ones perspective will depend on ones level of awareness. Separating the self from the mind takes a lot of work… ”
Great thinkers or organizers as you call them fail miserably in one thing. Their ideas are underpinned by this pedagogical conceit: that peoples can be educated to think correctly. How absurd. When I put forward that greed had to be controlled, I meant it. It’s like murder, theft and rape. You cannot simply educate people not to do these things, can you? You need laws and punishment to offenders. Same with greed in corporations. Why aren’t the greedy capitalists punished? Because current laws are still elitist and suffer the same mistake that conceited albeit humanist pedagogues have been making since civilization reached its maturity. Most people simply will not learn on their own, even Harvard grads.
KG on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 8:34 am
“[ grad na ang gagamitin ko, di na student ]”
its about time
ikaw naman oh, we are students for life naman eh.
hvrds on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 9:28 am
“We operate via groups. Advocacies are necessarily prejudicial to its opponents and they are “limbic†driven. Imagine using your higher brain functions on every personal decision, you would hardly move from your seat. Besides, you’ll need to have the power of mind control; otherwise it’s emotions and broad analyses that get the most votes.” Confused punditry
“Because current laws are still elitist and suffer the same mistake that conceited albeit humanist pedagogues have been making since civilization reached its maturity.” Really Confused punditry Civilization has already reached its maturity???
The entire foundation for equilibrium science and scientists is based on the absolute rationality of the human animal.
Medalla, Monsod, Sicat, Diokno, Habito, Pernia and some others are equilibrium scientists.
They actually believe in the perfection of human rationality.. They even measure it and use those measurements to support their zealotry. That is their basis for neo-liberal economic theology.
Ben Bernanke was said to have remarked recently – “there are no atheists in foxholes and no ideologues in a financial crisis.”
The Catholic Church in its advocacy of the rhythm method simply suggests that one find out when the woman is fertile and refrain from having intercourse. Off course there are other ways of sexual gratification without intercourse also during those days.
One has to control the limbic side during those days. But intercourse is not the only method for sexual gratification for pleasure… Discipline and self control is another choice. But educating people on that has no profit based principle. So you ask the state to socialize contraception because someone will profit.
The new improved “Joy of Sex” was just released. There are things unknown and or less commonly known in the past that has become acceptable today.
Greed is a broad description of man’s material needs. It is simply not based on money.
Milton Friedman the market anarchist said that man should not be hampered by rules. Drugs, prostitution, pornography should all be liberalized.
Man is an insatiable animal it seems. One reason of wanting to get rich is to have a plethora of choices.
Let me tell you, I have seen some of the wives of these big shots….. Your mouth will salivate at the sight of the women…
Today’s world is about trophies…. What do you think marketing consumerism is all about.
Driving a Ferrari will give you a limbic reaction… The tires and suspension are like suction cups when cornering at 90mph.
Simple question… What is the current definition of money????
BrianB on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 9:52 am
You don’t call modern civilization mature?
Equilibrium science? Please explain. Is this similar to the eastern yin-yang philosophy?
I think you’re agreeing with me here. What I said was rules curbing greed need be made. Greed exists and the damage it can cost should be accepted. Wasn’t rape natural back in the days? before civilization? So greed, we must accept, muddles the mind, even educated and brilliant minds, greed, hubris (which is the great man’s version of greed) have to have counter-measures. Wall street greed, unlike alleyway rape, isn’t being policed.
BrianB on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 9:55 am
Your argument is that man needs to be educated and should practice self-control. My argument: even educated man can rape, is greedy, can have his eyesight darkened by excessive desire. You need rules even for educated men.
hvrds on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 9:58 am
Most modern societies have progressive income taxes to moderate and regulate greed. There was a time when the top rate of the U.S. income tax bracket was taxed at 90%…
However capital gains tax is taxed at a lower rate.
But this was all changed by the entry of free market ideologies in the 70’s.
Command economies and liberal economies are really about contrasting fiscal policies.
Bakit hindi alam nang marami yun???
Oh, yeah, I do not own a Ferrari but my work allows me to interact with people who own or lease those monsters.
Believe me it really is a chick catcher…
hvrds on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 10:36 am
The Philippine government refuses to be bullied by Kato and Bravo who have said give us our land or we will kill your people…
The American bankers have told the American people through their representatives that apart form the over $500 billion already used to bail out institutions they need another $700 billion otherwise no more Starbucks and shopping… and you may lose not only your home but your job and savings as well. So pretty please buy out all out toxic paper.
Most Americans and the world do not know why they have to risk their future taxes to pay for these rich guys to maintain their lifestyle.
Now for highlights of Big Mike and GMA’S TRIP TO THE U.N. The one about San Marino and Andorra really takes the cake.
“For the rest of the day, Mrs. Arroyo will hold bilateral meetings with the leaders of St. Vincent and Grenadines, St. Kitts and Nevis, Andorra, San Marino and Ban.”
“Day 3 starts with bilateral meetings with the leaders of Cape Verde, Equatorial Guinea, Iceland, Belgium, Slovenia and Comoros.” Phil. Star
mlq3 on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 11:25 am
hvrds, maybe you can help identify how talk of the dbp’s $100 m USD exposure to Lehman Bros. papers can be confirmed or not. Talk is rife within business circles that Rey David is pretty much stuck in New York until he sorts things out: and that reputedly being the financial adviser of the President’s husband, it’s a reasonable assumption that they took a hit, too. Also, why is it that if memory serves me correctly, talk that the Aboitiz bank’s heavy exposure to subprime remains just that: talk, and not even reported in the papers. One businessman quipped that their bank simply has good P.R. or is it simply incomprehension on the part of business reporters?
Letran student on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 11:50 am
May harvard mba ho ba si hvrds? Kung puwede lang, mang harvard, paki-explain kung ano iyong nakakatakot daw na puwedeng mangyari kung hindi matuloy ang AIG bail-out. Bakit sabi ng Inquirer, wala naman daw mangyayari sa mga policies ng Philamlife. Ano nga ho ba ang problema?
cvj on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 12:10 pm
Since the global financial system is ready to tank, now might be a good time to repudiate (or declare a moratorium) on our Foreign Debt. What’s good for Wall Street and the American banks should be good for the Philippines as well.
Letran student on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 12:15 pm
magkaibigan ba si mang harvard at si ron nathan? Maganda iyong article ni mr bearbull sa inquirer tungkol sa bail-out.
http://business.inquirer.net/money/columns/view/20080923-162294/Paulsons-700-B-bailout
Sabi ni bearbull, China remains powerhouse. Siguro dapat mag-aral na talaga ng Mandarin. At saka abacus.
hvrds on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 1:21 pm
Re: DBP and Lehman. one of the toughest parts about doing business in the Philippines is the lack of laws requiring banks to fully disclose their trust or unit trust placements.
They are not required to do so. Try even asking Philam Life about the actual details of their investment portfolio.
There are a lot of incestuous relationships. For example Cuisia is head of one of SM’s companies but his Philam Life also has investments in a lot of SM’s instruments. They, Philam Life also acts as fund manger for SSS funds. Cuisia’s brother was also involved with the Aboitiz and Union Bank (formerly Interbank). Union Bank handles work also for GSIS…
The governments cash cows SSS,GSIS, DBP, Land Bank and the rest of the bunch are not required by law to disclose their portfolios. Even to the BSP…….
You will have to work at the other end – in the U.S. where disclosures are part of the system…Lehman filed for Chapter 11. they have to disclose all their assets worldwide with all their subsidiaries and shell companies. Walang ganyan dito sa Pilipinas.
One has first to check which major financial port has the information. Singapore or HK. The Asian HQ would be in one of these ports.
Metro Bank came clean because it knew where to go to seek resourse within their own backyard. Hence their move to put the Lehman companies here on receivership. A lot of those SPAVS are fronts for a lot of hot money… Metro bank also sold a lot of distressed assets in the past probably to Lehman. Then they lent them money to buy these assets … Nice huh…
Am personally involved in trying to settle some issues from the Asian crisis here with the special purpose vehicles created in the near past. Both banks involved no longer exist and are now BDO. It is like pulling teeth to get information.
Now for the local financial institutions under AIG. The U.S. government ay ngayon ay mayari ng AIG.
If the U.S. did not save AIG there is no way in the world your life insurance policies would have not been affected. Tthe probability would have been high that most of the net asset investments of the company would have crashed. Maybe only what you put in you would get back if at all.
hvrds does not stand for Harvard.
hvrds on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 2:27 pm
FT has just announced that Nomura, a Japanese brokerage form would be buying Lehman’s assets in Asia.
Metro Bank is in bed with big Japanese corporations. (Toyota) I would not worry about Metro.
The Philippine banking system is pretty stable.
You have land based Ayala -BPI, SM based BDO, Lucio Tan based PNB & Allied Bank (beer and cigarettes & PRC-China)), DBS (Singapore) backed Rizal Bank. Metro Bank – (Japs)
Union Bank – (SSS and GSIS)
You might say that Lucio Tan actually is our Central Bank. He has more capital than the BSP… BSP lahat utang….
BrianB on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 4:14 pm
So wala na ang INVESTMENT BANKING as a profession?
BrianB on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 4:19 pm
And, hrvds, why didn’t lehman bros go the way of morgan stanley and goldman sachs?
nash on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 6:02 pm
Investment bank bonuses last year in the City (ie that golden area in London where the banks are) amounted to an estimated £35B and the average bonus of investment bankers was at £191K.
UP n grad on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 8:01 pm
Hongkong-Shanghai Bank, Barclays, Royal bank Scotland, Deutsche, other European and Asian financial institutions made their phone calls and now, Paulson says that these banks can get bailed out, too.
I hope McCain and Obama put a stop to this foreign bailout. US should buy “toxic derivatives” from, say, Barclays only if England crafts a bail-out plan similar to the US.
UP n grad on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 8:02 pm
Hongkong-Shanghai Bank, Barclays, Royal bank Scotland, Deutsche, other European and Asian financial institutions made their phone calls and now, Paulson says that these banks can get bailed out, too.
I hope McCain and Obama put a stop to this foreign bailout. US should buy “toxic derivatives” from, say, Barclays only if England crafts a bail-out plan similar to the US.
The Ca t on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 8:03 pm
i like it when someone talks like he’s an authority and impresses that he is privy to the financial kitty of the tai pans.
When asked to explain, an economic phenomenon resorts to gibberish/copy pasted articles which are chosen for self-serving purposes.
nash on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 8:17 pm
“I hope McCain and Obama put a stop to this foreign bailout”
The ‘foreigners’ are being/requesting to be bailed out too because they also have huge investments in the USA and have thousands of US employees.
It’s probably a tough choice.
Basta, kawawa the next usa president.
supremo on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 9:23 pm
nash,
‘(ie that golden area in London where the banks are) ‘
Canary Wharf
nash on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 9:27 pm
The City and Canary Wharf are not the same but they share a ‘border’
jcc on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 10:05 pm
“I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs.†(Thomas Jefferson to Sec. Gallatin) HVRDS,
This has been addressed when banks are subjected to Federal Regulations.
The other dangerous tyrants are court judges:
“[For the] difficult task in curbing the Judiciary in their enterprises on the Constitution . . . the best [remedy] I can devise would be to give future commissions to judges for six years [the Senatorial term] with a re-appointmentability by the president with the approbation of both houses. If this would not be independence enough, I know not what would be . . .
The Judiciary perversions of the Constitution will forever be protected under the pretext of errors of judgment, which by principle are exempt from punishment. Impeachment therefore is a bugbear which they fear not at all. But they would be under some awe of the canvas of their conduct which would be open to both houses regularly every sixth year. It is a misnomer to call a government republican, in which a branch of the supreme power is independent of the nation. (Thomas Jefferson letter to Senator James Pleasants, 1821).
This tyranny of the court has not been addressed even up to this time. There should be an oversight committee that should be created to make an annual audit of the Court’s actions/decisions and the Committee must report it to the people, Congress and the Executive, or make them hold office for 6 years as suggested by T. Jefferson.
nash on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 10:13 pm
Why did the Supreme court prevent you from practicing law ba? Please expound so we know these oft-repeated ‘errors in judgement’
Since you already published an open letter (in a blog, of all places) you might as well enlighten us.
cheers,
jcc on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 10:36 pm
nash,
just visit my blog…. its all there..
jcc on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 10:40 pm
btw, nash. that open letter was received by CJ Puno Sept. 8, 2008… was published in my blog after that date.
supremo on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 10:42 pm
mlq3,
Break into P.O. BOX 703 in Pacific Palisades to get the Aboitiz’s financial statements.
nash on Tue, 23rd Sep 2008 11:37 pm
@jcc
it’s not really clear. too many words and digressions.
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 12:34 am
nash,
here is the bottomline. SC said that there were different versions of the alleged incident, but then it proceeded to discuss only the version of the complainant and the ibp and no discussion was devoted to my version which is outlined in my two motions for reconsideration. read my two motions and compare it to the conclusion of the SC.
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 12:43 am
nash,
before even I read T. Jefferson, I have written in my book the following:
“Of the three branches of government, it is the Supreme Court which is in a very enviable position of power. Unlike the President and the members of Congress who have to seek the mandate of the people every six years, four or three years, the
members of the Supreme Court have a life tenure and they continue to serve as members of the Court throughout their fruitful as well as fruitless lives and even if they misbehaved while in office. The only way the people can boot out a corrupt jurist in
office is if he resigns or retire from office in a huff or in a hush. If you try to impeach a Jurist of the Supreme Court, he would throw every bag of tricks on your way to protect his employment and sometimes he would invoke a constitutional technicality if convenient.
And despite of what Mr. Marcos had done to the country during the darkest years of his misrule, some people could not help but feel nostalgic about the initial martial law years where he had purged the misfits in the Courts and had dismantled the private armies of the provincial warlords.”
Reference on SC Justice retiring or resigning can be further clarified if you read the entry in my blog: “The Sins of the Supreme Court”.
supremo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 1:54 am
jcc,
‘The other dangerous tyrants are court judges’
Commenting in mlq’s blog will not solve your problem with the Philippine judiciary. Spare us the agony.
nash on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 2:35 am
@jcc
that doesn’t answer why they ‘banned’ (or whatever) you for a year. anyways, supremo is right, since you brought it up, it piqued my curiosity, now I don’t think I’ll get a straight answer in plain enqlish so I will stop. best wishes.
Rodolfo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 3:42 am
to jcc: Have you already applied for reinstatement of your license to practice law? Do you apply to the Philippine bar association or do you apply to the Philippine Supreme Court?
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 3:54 am
supremo,
and i am not trying to solve my problem over MLQ’s blog.
the comment about court’s tyranny was in relation with hrvds’ comment on private banks’ tyranny both of which have jeffersonian foundation, and not entirely about my case until nash has inquired about it.
rodolfo,
ibp has already certified me in good standing. it is the SC that does not….
Rodolfo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 3:57 am
to nash: jcc34’s blogsite does mention the technical term for the transgression. Jcc34 mentions that the California Bar Association asked him if he had already been rehabilitated (and a sign of “rehabilitated”, I suppose, is that jcc’s license-to-practice law in the Philippines has been renewed).
Rodolfo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 3:58 am
…. fading out….
supremo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 4:04 am
jcc,
‘and i am not trying to solve my problem over MLQ’s blog’
yeah sure.
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 4:07 am
supremo,
if your life has no colorful substance please do not begrudge others having one…. have you tried fighting someone not of your own size in the past? if not i can understand why you agonized over the fight of someone you wish you yourself could have done.
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 4:08 am
supremo,
i have my own blog to take care of my fighting.
nash on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 4:36 am
@rodolfo
I don’t know what ‘technical extortion’ means. So from my naive non-lawyerly background, all one has to do is prove innocence. I don’t see how calling the SC ‘corrupt’ or that ‘judges are tyrants’ will help matters.
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 4:38 am
nash,
i ask myself the SC what that means and unfortunately the SC did not care to answer. Please read my two motions if you are interested in finding out the truth.
what makes you think that the SC is infallible?
supremo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 4:46 am
jcc,
‘if your life has no colorful substance please do not begrudge others having one…. have you tried fighting someone not of your own size in the past? if not i can understand why you agonized over the fight of someone you wish you yourself could have done.’
You are fighting the Supreme Court from quite a distance and where they don’t have jurisdiction over you. You don’t fight fair. You are too immature for your age.
My life has nothing to do with you. I will not agonize over your fight.
What colorful substance are you talking about? Is that the colorful money that you were paid for representing both sides of the case?
Since you have your own blog, do your unfair fighting in your own blog. You can be both blogger and commenter.
nash on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 4:58 am
@jcc
I don’t think ANYONE is infallible and I certainly did not mean to suggest that.
If you put a 300-word abstract on your blog, I’d probably read it. Reading two wordy motions with lifestory is not my usual way to pass my internet time.
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 4:59 am
supremo,
read the facts carefully… do not go to conclusions because those conclusions were not supported by facts.
before you argue read also my two motions. it is the SC that was not fair…it renders a resolution on my case without my input and even without giving me the courtesy of replying to those recommendation.
please read the facts … if you are interested in the truth.
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 5:04 am
nash,
i cannot do a synopsis of my case here. you see even a hint about it drew already a violent reaction from supremo.
leytenian on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 5:12 am
The people’s bank of china made the same mistake as almost as the major financial institutions in EU and US.
nash on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 5:13 am
i did not mean here, i’d happily read it in your blog. but everytime i click a link on your blog the first paragraph alone is a turn off.
which brings me to my second point, why are pinoy lawyers very wordy?
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 5:26 am
supremo,
have you tried figthing mr. marcos? have you been incarcerated during martial law? do you think i will run away from the supreme court on purpose? it is incidental only that its resolution came when we are already in America, and not because i wanted to run. i do not run away from a good fight… i cannot go back to the Philippines just so i can fight the supreme court. my family is here.. how about you? have you done your own fighting? what are your credentials? your choice of handle is indicative enough of your bloated ego, supremo, nek, nek
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 5:28 am
nash,
i could not help you.
nash on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 5:39 am
anyways jcc if you so insist that the sc is corrupt or that the judges are tyrants, i don’t see the point of even submitting yourself to them. sadly, they regulate your profession so I wish you good luck
leytenian on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 5:51 am
I am curious where Gloria invested her fortune… her annuities pay-out. the American truck drivers, waitresses and other tax payers will not pay extra annuities to an almost bankrupt AIG. Annuities are part of AIG’s holdings and they are not FDIC insured. Annuities may appear insure because it promise a minimum monthly payment to begin some time in the future….
NOT insured by the FDIC
” * The contents of safe deposit boxes. Even though the word deposit appears in the name, under federal law a safe deposit box is not a deposit account—it’s strictly a well-secured storage space rented by an institution to a customer. If you are concerned about the safety or replacement of items you put into a safe deposit box, ask your insurance agent whether your homeowner’s or renter’s insurance policy covers your safe deposit box against damage or theft.
* Losses due to theft or fraud at the institution. However, these situations often are covered by special insurance policies that banking institutions buy from private insurance companies.
* Errors made in your accounts. In these situations, there may be remedies for consumers under state contract law, the Uniform Commercial Code, and some federal regulations, depending on the type of transaction.
* Insurance and annuity products, such as life, auto and homeowner’s insurance. Not only are these products not backed by the FDIC, but some insurance products may even lose value.
* Stocks, bonds and mutual funds.
* Investments backed by the U.S. government, such as Treasury securities and Savings Bonds.”
hvrds on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 5:54 am
HVRDS,
This has been addressed when banks are subjected to Federal Regulations, Totally stupid comment…
Lehman Brothers and AIG were not under any Federal regulation. Lehman is an investment banker. Before the so called legal maven responds he has to remember where the evolution of banking has led the globe to. From the money leneders on a bench to the fancy towers today. The commentaries here also dwelt with the repeal of Glass Steagal.
The whole blow up today caused by the housing bubble explosion is based on the increasing falirue of derivative instiruments starting with credit default swaps. Lehman and AIG got caught with their pants down. These markets are totally unregulated and never has been regulated. Lehman however does not have either a deposit taking institution but AIG is a large insurance company that takes premiums from clients.
Just recently the last two remaing invesmtnet banks, Glodman and Morgan Stanley have asked permission to change their charter and to become a universal bank. Meaing they will become a regular bank also . The are looking to buy a deposit taking institution. So they will come under the Fed and also the FDIC.
The entire history of finacial crisis has been precisely the failure of regulation and effective intervention by Federal authorities.
The utter failure of the Federal Reserve in the 20’s in the face of hundreds and hundreds of banks shutting their doors to pump in liquidity into a credit contraction was the ultimate cause of the Great Depression…
The same thing is happening today at the level of investment banking and ‘trust banking’ that has bought and sold exotic derivative instruments held up by the price of an underlying asset. One particluar asset -home prices is collapsing and is taking the entire house (derivatives) cards down.
The entire house of cards based on leverage is deleveraging at the level of these fancy banking instruments and it is finding its way back to the balance sheets of deposit taking institutions. Those deposit taking institutions like WAMU and Indy Mac are now technically bankrupt.
The falling dominoes are weaving its way through the system.. those that placed the heavier bets on housing are all falling the first.
That is why the government would like to stem the collapse of housing prices by buying a portion of these toxic housing backed securities to create a market for it when none exists. That is acutally a sneaky way for tax payers to recapitalize banks. Thje argument in Congress today is for the government to take equity postions in these corporations.. Actually you are going to reward those that caused the problems in the first palce.
How can a supposed legal maven make a singular statement that all banks are under federal regulation when we are witnessing a market that had gone amuck and now is collapsing due to non-regulation and deregulation.
A perfect example of functional illiteracy and lack of cognition.
hvrds on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 5:58 am
There is a saying in the legal profession…
“Those who try to lawyer for themselves in court has a fool for a lawyer…”
The clear bias is more than palpable….
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 6:04 am
hvrds,
there is no objective truth… only one’s bias.
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 6:21 am
U.S. banks are under federal regulation and that is a fact. If banks collapse despite regulation, because the controls were not followed by the banks or there was lax in the regulation.
there are traffic rules in place. if accident happens, it does not argue for the lack of traffic rules, only that people miserably failed to observe the rules.
you may be a financial whiz but you lack basic logic.
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 6:33 am
hvrds,
you said private banks in relation to T Jefferson’s letter to Gallatin. Lehman and AIG are not the banks as contemplated by T. Jefferson.
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 6:49 am
in 1802, Jefferson has no concept whatsoever of investment houses and other institutions doing some business in the likesof Lehman Brothers and AIG and when he mentioned private banks, these are the regular banks that that take deposits and lends money to the public. these are the institutions he wanted placed under federal regulations. If Lehman and AIG were not subjected to federal regulations could be because they do not fall in the category of private banks that are under federal regulation.
but i doubt seriously if these investment companies can freely operate themselves without filing up their incorporation papers and be subject to some control from monetary regulators, or in our case, by the PDIC.
nash on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 6:52 am
@jcc
isn’t there a difference between an investment bank and a commercial bank?? the ftc has no control over investment banks…no?
nash on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 6:59 am
ok, it’s pedantic, investment banks fall under the SEC regulations and the SEC is a federal agency? (I dunno, I’m asking), thus IBs are under federal regulations.
supremo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 7:16 am
‘drew already a violent reaction from supremo’
This conclusion came from someone who extorts money from helpless people.
supremo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 7:18 am
jcc,
‘i do not run away from a good fight’
But you are in the United States fighting the Supreme Court in your blog?
Whatever dude.
leytenian on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 7:45 am
hvrds,
“Lehman Brothers and AIG were not under any Federal regulation. Lehman is an investment banker”
I think you are wrong…. AIG, the parent company is Federally regulated but the trouble lies beyond the oversight of State Insurance Regulators.
Lehman Brothers Bank’s deposits are insured by the Deposit Insurance Fund, which is administered by the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation (FDIC)
Investments such as mutual funds, stocks and other products are not federally insured ( see my post previously on not FDIC insured) BUT FEDERALLY REGULATED because no INDIVIDUALS are allowed to sell investment products without a license regulated by the State ( Licensing) and Series 6.7 for SEC- Federal Regulators.
No one is allowed to package mortgages and sell it to the secondary market unless a bank , entity, organization is a mortgage company. In the case of AIG, it has it’s own branch of doing business as a mortgage companies ( AIG mortgage capital) and the biggest PMI company ( AIG United Guaranty) Both companies are Federally and State Regulated. The liquidity problem of AIG’s subsidiaries ( AIG mortgage and AIG United) hurt the parent company…Actually there’s more specialty subsidiary that AIG provides to the world… As I said, no one is allowed to sell its products without Federal and State Oversight thru licensing of business entity, licensing of the person involved and disclosing quarterly statements. All AIG’s branch subsidiaries have websites with Financial Statements on pdf files…
An investor is responsible for all the risk involve thus a propectus is required. If a bank from China is investing, then that bank is responsible for the risk of its investment.
But I will agree with you that Federal Regulators ( SEC) missed its proper regulation on risky operations.
leytenian on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 7:50 am
any investment transaction requires an agent.. license in the State or for a company, federally regulated. everybody got greedy including the professionals who represented and sold those products. commission was high and it was easy money.
leytenian on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 8:07 am
hvrds,
“Actually you are going to reward those that caused the problems in the first place.”
don’t bee too confident in posting. your post is always one sided. I agree with jcc…
as you said, read read read… have you been reading at all.. sounds like your limbic system is now clouding your higher brain function and you’re not even a woman… lol..
Financial Crisis Winners and Losers
http://www.nysun.com/business/financial-crisis-winners-and-losers/86401/
“But there is a long list of losers too. Large institutions and well-off private investors have protected their savings through the activities of hedge funds. Their short-selling attacks on vulnerable banks have sparked mergers that, in normal times, would have been out of bounds for anti-trust reasons – illustrated in particular by the Lloyds-HBOS deal. And these will provoke large job losses that are bound to bring political and social repercussions in the U.S., Britain and other affected countries.”
http://www.investors.com/breakingnews.asp?journalid=80308496
supremo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 9:02 am
jcc,
‘do not go to conclusions because those conclusions were not supported by facts’
Talk to the Supreme Court not me.
‘before you argue read also my two motions’
I rather read the kilometric post of hvrds.
‘have you tried figthing mr. marcos? have you been incarcerated during martial law?’
Too young to do it but I usually side with the good like Voltes V and Mazinger Z.
‘what are your credentials?’
The technical extortionist asking for credentials? There is something wrong here.
‘your choice of handle is indicative enough of your bloated ego’
My bloated ego was caused by drinking too much Pepsi. Burp!
supremo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 9:10 am
nash ,
‘ok, it’s pedantic, investment banks fall under the SEC regulations and the SEC is a federal agency?’
Commercial banks under Federal Reserve Bank and investment banks under the SEC. SEC has no money and Federal Reserve has the money. Federal Reserve gets the money from treasury notes issued by the Treasury Department.
supremo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 9:36 am
Leytenian to hvrds,
‘I think you are wrong…. AIG, the parent company is Federally regulated but the trouble lies beyond the oversight of State Insurance Regulators.’
AIG is a bank holding company that owns a commercial bank AIG Federal Savings Bank or AIG Bank. Bank holding companies are under the Federal Reserve.
leytenian on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 10:23 am
supremo,
to avoid confusion, please visit wikepedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_International_Group
you will see how big this company is…it’s not a bank but a COMPLEX company… for discussion purposes, focus on its on subprime mortgage business. “AIG’s share prices fell over 95% to just $1.25 on September 16, 2008, from a 52-week high of $70.13. The company reported over $13.2 billion in losses in the first six months of the year”
The most recent on TV, FBI is investigating about 22 mortgage company including fannie mae, freddie, countrywide and many more.
Looking on the bottom of wikepedia, where is Philamlife Philippines belong.. or where is GSIS and SS are being invested…. google search..
supremo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 10:53 am
leytenian,
I did not say that AIG is a bank. I said it is a BANK HOLDING COMPANY that owns a bank. There is a difference. Maybe you should look up ‘bank holding company’ in wiki.
supremo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:04 am
‘I am curious where Gloria invested her fortune’
Aboitiz family members bought several thousand AIG shares at @ $26 per share.
hvrds on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:07 am
‘I think you are wrong…. AIG, the parent company is Federally regulated but the trouble lies beyond the oversight of State Insurance Regulators.’Another illiterate
Insurance companies are not federally regulated. The same with investment banks… There is a difference between state and federal jurisdiction in the U.S.
Morgan Stanley and Goldman Sachs are changing over their charter to become a bank holding company which will put them under Federal regulators. They will buy a deposit taking institution..
AIG the juridical entity can own banks but the juridical entity AIG whose main purpose is insurance is not under the purview of the FED. The bank which would be another juridical entity owned by AIG would be under the FED…
Previously CITIGROUP was composed of Travelers Life, Smith Barney, Citibank and other divisions. Citigroup is a bank holding company.
They have already shed Travelers Life.. Citigroup has retail/consumer banking, commercial banking, corporate banking, investment banking, private banking, asset wealth management and other services.
hvrds on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:08 am
The real problem is with insurance products….
Buffett’s “time bomb” goes off on Wall Street
Fri Sep 19 07:29:23 UTC 2008
By James B. Kelleher
CHICAGO (Reuters) – On Main Street, insurance protects people from the effects of catastrophes.
But on Wall Street, specialized insurance known as a credit default swaps are turning a bad situation into a catastrophe.
When historians write about the current crisis, much of the blame will go to the slump in the housing and mortgage markets, which triggered the losses, layoffs and liquidations sweeping the financial industry.
But credit default swaps — complex derivatives originally designed to protect banks from deadbeat borrowers — are adding to the turmoil.
“This was supposedly a way to hedge risk,” says Ellen Brown, the author of the book “Web of Debt.”
“I’m sure their predictive models were right as far as the risk of the things they were insuring against. But what they didn’t factor in was the risk that the sellers of this protection wouldn’t pay … That’s what we’re seeing now.”
Brown is hardly alone in her criticism of the derivatives. Five years ago, billionaire investor Warren Buffett called them a “time bomb” and “financial weapons of mass destruction” and directed the insurance arm of his Berkshire Hathaway to exit the business.
LINKED TO MORTGAGES
Recent events suggest Buffett was right. The collapse of Bear Stearns. The fire sale of Merrill Lynch. The meltdown at American International Group . In each case, credit default swaps played a role in the fall of these financial giants.
The latest victim is insurer AIG, which received an emergency $85 billion (47 billion pounds) loan from the U.S. Federal Reserve late on Tuesday to stave off a bankruptcy.
Over the last three quarters, AIG suffered $18 billion of losses tied to guarantees it wrote on mortgage-linked derivatives.
Its struggles intensified in recent weeks as losses in its own investments led to cuts in its credit ratings. Those cuts triggered clauses in the policies AIG had written that forced it to put up billions of dollars in extra collateral — billions it did not have and could not raise.
EASY MONEY
When the credit default market began back in the mid-1990s, the transactions were simpler, more transparent affairs. Not all the sellers were insurance companies like AIG — most were not. But the protection buyer usually knew the protection seller.
As it grew — according to the industry’s trade group, the credit default market grew to $46 trillion by the first half of 2007 from $631 billion in 2000 — all that changed.
An over-the-counter market grew up and some of the most active players became asset managers, including hedge fund managers, who bought and sold the policies like any other investment.
And in those deals, they sold protection as often as they bought it — although they rarely set aside the reserves they would need if the obligation ever had to be paid.
In one notorious case, a small hedge fund agreed to insure UBS, the Swiss banking giant, from losses related to defaults on $1.3 billion of subprime mortgages for an annual premium of about $2 million.
The trouble was, the hedge fund set up a subsidiary to stand behind the guarantee — and capitalized it with just $4.6 million. As long as the loans performed, the fund made a killing, raking in an annualized return of nearly 44 percent.
But in the summer of 2007, as home owners began to default, things got ugly. UBS demanded the hedge fund put up additional collateral. The fund balked. UBS sued.
The dispute is hardly unique. Both Wachovia and Citigroup are involved in similar litigation with firms that promised to step up and act like insurers — but were not actually insurers.
“Insurance companies have armies of actuaries and deep pools of policyholders and the financial wherewithal to pay claims,” says Mike Barry, a spokesman at the Insurance Information Institute.
‘SLOPPY’
Another problem: As hedge funds and others bought and sold these protection policies, they did not always get prior written consent from the people they were supposed to be insuring. Patrick Parkinson, the deputy director of the Fed’s research and statistic arm, calls the practice “sloppy.”
As a result, some protection buyers had trouble figuring out who was standing behind the insurance they bought. And it put investors into webs of relationships they did not understand.
“This is the derivative nightmare that everyone has been warning about,” says Peter Schiff, the president of Euro Pacific Capital at the author of “Crash Proof: How to Profit From the Coming Economic Collapse.”
“They booked all these derivatives assuming bad things would never happen. It was like writing fire insurance, assuming no one is ever going to have a fire, only now they’re turning around and watching as the whole town burns down.”
hvrds on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:16 am
Can anyone comprehend the notional value of these instruments (CDS) at $46 trillion?????
The total GDP of the world is only around $50 trillion……
Can the limbic twins state which regulator has jurisdiction over these credit default swaps bought by banks who lend money out and buy these insurance products when the insurance companies do not have the capital to pay on these policies?????
That would mean a lot of loans on the books of banks are now worthless…
That would mean that a lot of deposit taking institutions are capital impaired………..
I think the magnitude of this problem is hard to be grasped by people who still cannot define what money is….
Rodolfo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:19 am
McCain is getting into worse trouble —- from Republicans!!! Very apparent the past week is that McCain is impulsive, temperamental, and angry.
George Will said of McCain:
. . .the more one sees of his impulsive, intensely personal reactions to people and events, the less confidence one has that he would select judges by calm reflection and clear principles, having neither patience nor aptitude for either.
…Under the pressure of the financial crisis, one presidential candidate is behaving like a flustered rookie playing in a league too high. It is not Barack Obama.
. . . . .John McCain furiously, and apparently without even looking around at facts, said Chris Cox, chairman of the Securities and Exchange Commission, should be decapitated.
hvrds on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:28 am
“The $7.5bn boost in equity comes a day after Goldman received an accelerated approval from the Federal Reserve to restructure itself as a bank holding company. The transition from pure investment bank – which could operate outside the regulatory purview of the Fed – to bank holding company was designed to allay investor concerns about the future of Goldman’s business model.”
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/83bf493c-89ba-11dd-8371-0000779fd18c.html
Paulson’s plan was not a true solution to the crisis
By Martin Wolf
Published: September 23 2008 19:38 | Last updated: September 23 2008 19:38
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/a09b317e-898d-11dd-8371-0000779fd18c.html
“Desperate times call for desperate measures. But remember, no less, that decisions taken in haste may shape the financial system for a generation. Speed is essential. But it is no less essential to get any new regime right.”
“No doubt, the crisis has long passed the stage when governments could leave the private sector to save itself, with just a little help from central banks. For the US, the rescue of Bear Stearns was the moment when that option evaporated. But the events of the past two and a half weeks – the rescues of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, the failure of Lehman Brothers, the sale of Merrill Lynch, the rescue of AIG, the flight to safety in the markets and the decisions by Morgan Stanley and Goldman Sachs to become regulated bank holding companies – have made a comprehensive solution inevitable. ” Martin Wolf
Why is it correct to stand on the platform provided by idiots…So many more will become aware…
leytenian on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:31 am
“That would mean a lot of loans on the books of banks are now worthless” That would mean that a lot of deposit taking institutions are capital impaired…
Subprime Mortgage
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8hjUei-Nwo&feature=related
Subprime derivatives
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YNyn1XGyWg&feature=related
hvrds on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:44 am
When unregulated hedge funds and investment banks held large positions in the futures oil market all backed up by leverage credit the government did not allow those positions to collapse thereby benefiting the world with lower oil prices. They instead want to keep the prices high until the positions are unwound and deleveraged.
Ginigisa ang tao sa sariling mantika.
Is that fair to billions of consumers?????
Government Assistance
Bailing Out The Oil Market
William Pentland, 09.23.08, 11:35 AM ET
“While everyone knows the U.S. government is looking to bail Wall Street banks, few people realize that it’s also bailing out speculative oil and commodities traders in the process, fueling a sharp rise in energy prices.”
“Lehman Brothers (nyse: LEH – news – people ) and AIG (nyse: AIG – news – people ) held enormous trading positions in commodities markets. If those positions had been liquidated suddenly, the price of everything from wheat to oil would have collapsed. The Commodity Futures Trading Commission, the main regulator of U.S. commodity markets, allowed Wall Street’s investment banks and trading companies to take control of massive positions in commodities markets called swaps held by Lehman Brothers and AIG.”
http://www.forbes.com/2008/09/23/energy-oil-washington-biz-cx_wp_0923energy.html?partner=alerts
leytenian on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:46 am
subprime derivatives explain:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YNyn1XGyWg&feature=related
leytenian on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:49 am
hvrds,
this might relax you…. lol
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37pal-PYTUQ
the song is great..
leytenian on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:56 am
You’ve got the FED after the bear
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9ZlxsEioUA
hvrds on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 12:51 pm
In China the makers of the toxic milk products will probably be executed.
In the U.S. the sellers of those toxic instruments will get bailed out and will be able to save their wealth.
Millions of the victims will not have a clue on what happened or why it happened?
The buyer beware principle prevails in the U.S.
Gordon Gecko lives on….
nash on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 3:19 pm
anyways regulated or not, i think most people have little sympathy for these people anyway
1. lawyers = negative contribution to gdp
2. investment bankers = schmucks who just shuffle money they don’t have.
cheers to their demise!
nash on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 4:53 pm
Incidentally is our dear beloved leader GMA in New York for the UN Assembly?
Is she pursuing greater economic ties with, er, St. Kits and Nevis, to help us weather the storm? Coconut trade perhaps?
Or is she so toxic like those loans that no other country wants to meet with her?
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 7:28 pm
supremo,
that’s your problem.. you conclude without reading.. in that case you take the position also that SC is an infallible institution. goo day to you son.
Rodolfo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 7:49 pm
to jcc: Have you already applied for reinstatement of your license to practice law?
Your license to practice law has been suspended. Solatan vs Attys Inocentes and Camano: On the basis of acts branded by the Integrated Bar of the Philippines (IBP) as “bordering on technical extortion,†accepting funds and giving unsolicited advice to an adverse party, and casting doubts as to the procedure of levy, the IBP resolved[1] to recommend the suspension of Atty. Camano from the practice of law for one (1) year.
Pero at the end of the suspension period, hindi automatically ibibigay uli sa iyo ang lisensiya mo. [Malay nila, baka gusto mong maging nurse na lang, o maging seaman.] The Philippine Supreme Court was correct when it told California Bar that your license to practice law remained suspended — hindi ka naman pala nag-apply for re-instatement, eh.
nash on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 8:36 pm
Maybe Rodolfo’s companero needs to hire a competent lawyer? Surely there is at least one, lawyers aren’t exactly endangered species (although we want them to be…diploma mills like UP Law School and The Ateneo keep churning them out faster than the landfills can accommodate)
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 8:56 pm
rodolfo,
are you a Supreme Court insider? Why did not the SC tell California Bar that I need to reapply to continue my practice? And why did the IBP gave me a certtificate of good standing already?
nash,
if you at least give us where you graduated from, we can telegraph your contempt for UP and Ateneo as diploma mills… But if you read close enough you will see that most advertisement for lawyers in newspapers specifically require that applicants must be from UP and Ateno only.
if you failed your UPCAT, or Ateneo Admission Test, we can share with your contempt and frustration.
nash on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 9:02 pm
i say they are diploma mills because despite the market being saturated with lawyers, they still continue to produce them more than we need them.
as for your ateneo or upcat test. no i do not do multiple choice exams.
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 9:12 pm
rodolfo,
the recommendation of the IBP was modified by the SC such that it found me not guilty of “giving unsolicited advice”. The recommendation for “technical extortion” was affirmed. I asked the SC through my two motions what is this “legal animal” in the kingdom, “technical extortion”, when what I was doing was to implement a “lawful court order”. Extortion or its dichotomy technical extortion is when without lawful purpose/motive you ask some to pay up with threat. I was armed with the decision of the trial court which has become executory to implement the order of eviction, the tenant was long gone but the brother CPA and his mother occupied the unit without informing the landlord about the tenant having vacated the premises already.
When served with the Order of the Sheriff to vacate the apartment, mother-son tandem went to our office and promise to pay the arrears. I accepted their offer and CPA brother paid 50% (P5,000, more or less $100) of the attorney’s fee and P1,000 for sheriff’s cost.
This CPA promised to pay the arrears and the current rent. Later he issued four postdated checks. One check was cashed the second check bounced for account closed. I ejected him and her mother from the apartment when the second check bounced.
So where can you find extortion in that scenario?
The SC did not even care to answer my query?
nash on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 9:13 pm
and before you accuse me again of contempt, I fully support UP. I think a developing country should have a good state university system.
But if it were possible to personally allocate the tax that we pay, I do not want it ending up subsidising the law department. No good has ever come out of that black hole. (Well, okey, I submit there were/are good people but they are far outnumbered by the rotten apples..)
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 9:17 pm
nash,
so what type of exam you are good at and what diploma mill did you come from?
nash on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 9:29 pm
i don’t release my cv unless you are offering me a job ano.
Rodolfo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 9:35 pm
jcc: maniwala man ako sa iyo o hindi, no-epek — iyong kaso “Solatan vs Inocentes & Camano”, na-disesyonan na. Hindi ako ang katalo mo. Ang katalo mo, iyong IBP Investigating Commissioner, Siegfred B. Mison.
You already served the one-year suspension, eh di mag-apply ka na for re-instatement. Mukha namang kapag nag-apply ka for re-instatement, dere-derecho ang approval. After reinstatement, wala na dapat problema sa California Bar. Eh ano pa naman ang hinihintay mo …. mag-apply ka na for re-instatement.
Downplay the sama ng loob, bawasan ng kaunti iyong drama against Philippine legal system dahil ang pag-kaintindi ko, your more important goal is that you get allowed to practice law in America.
Rodolfo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 9:44 pm
jcc: If a future Michigan client or California client were to find out about Solatan and “technical extortion”, you can suggest the “… bulok ang legal system ng Pilipinas” .
And if you can show where the Philippines has reinstated your law license, and if you then show them your license to practice law in US-of-A, mukha namang “CASE CLOSED”, di ba?
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 9:49 pm
rodolfo,
you are still missing the point… it has nothing to do at all with my intention to practice in california… i already wrote a book even before I asked for my right to continue my practice, the purpose of which is to bring to public consciousness that the SC is not always right and it has no monopoly over truth, righteousness, morality and virtue.
and don’t tell me about “sama ng loob”. one’s quest for justice is better understood from the viewpoint of one who was subjected to injustice.
we have a society in P.I., headed by Mr. Jimenez, i think is it “Criminal Watch Society?, the members of which are one way of another had suffered pain under the hands of the criminals. One member is Esconde?, the widower whose family were killed, and a daughter raped and one involved is the son of former senator of the country.
One member is a widow of a lawyer who was slain in Laguna for political vendetta.
But most members were those who have kins who were subjected to brutal murders.
They banded themselves together and made their views known about the criminalities in the country and their contempt of the state of affairs of the country.
Never for one moment tell them that they should shut up because they were spousing their bias against the criminals and against a justice system that have failed..
analogy: do not tell me that my “sama ng loob” is so personal… because from my standpoint, i am fighting a very noble cause just like the “Criminal Watch Society” was doing.
cvj on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 9:51 pm
jcc, i agree with rodolfo. we’re not in any way part of the equation so if all that is needed is for you to apply for reinstatement, then better for you to keep your eye on the prize. there’ll be time to revisit events after that.
cvj on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 9:57 pm
ok jcc scratch that., i wrote the above (9:51) before reading your comment (at 9:49).
Rodolfo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 10:02 pm
jcc: With fire in your bellyand your belief that you fight for a very noble cause, then tatabi na lang ako.
Pero huwag kang magugulat kong may mga tao na iiling ang ulo kung iko-kompara mo Escalante “technical etxtortion” to “Burgos-missing” or Esconde.
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 10:10 pm
Mr. Vizconde of Paranaque not Esconde, and the daughter who died and was raped i think was Carmela?
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 10:14 pm
rodolfo,
if you consider your honor your life, you can understand the analogy of the Vizconde Murder and my case.
cvj on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 10:20 pm
jcc, just don’t let it consume you, life is too short as it is. my dad spent a good part of his retirement years trying to help my elder brother get cleared from an analogous situation. he suffered a stroke because of the stress and his health has not been the same ever since.
supremo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:06 pm
jcc,
‘that’s your problem.. you conclude without reading’
Tatang makakalimutin ka na pala. Kayo po ang may problema hindi ako.
I don’t conclude without reading. I’m just not intrested in your case. So go back to your blog and post a comment on your own case. Malay niyo sagutin niyo ang comment dahil nakalimutan niyo na kayo pala ang nag-post ng comment.
nash on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:25 pm
grabe, it’s so nice watching the laundry dry and talagang melodramatic ang mga analogies. pero medyo naman nasobrahan yata yung comparison sa vizconde. (that was a very tragic case!)…i think this case should have been more closer sa mga kaso ni cristy fermin
but this is a good sign no? pag slow news day at ang paglalaba lamang ang ating napag-uusapan, ibig sabihin walang grabeng bad news for our punditry. yay.
yung iba naman, baka nangungulekta pa ng kanilang mga google search results, hintayin lang natin konti ang mga copy paste na talaga namang ikakatuwa ng elmer’s super glue.
Pilipinoparin on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:32 pm
At this point, I agree with jcc. Fight for your right at any cost. Ultimately it will not benefit jcc alone. This maybe a wake up call to those “erring lawyers” ( that is, if what jcc’s story is correct).
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:32 pm
cvj,
thanks..
supremo,
you said that i extort people.. that is a conclusion. i said read the facts but you are not interested with my case you are only interested in the conclusion.. and therefore you believe that SC is infallible. i don’t blame you for your belief… that is the spirit of democracy.. as long as you are honest in your belief, i cannot fault you for that.
but you have not explained well that your handle, Supremo is bloated with egomanianism.
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:37 pm
pilipinoparin,
thanks…
supremo on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:41 pm
jcc,
‘Supremo is bloated with egomanianism’
It only came from you so it’s ok.
This one came from the Supreme Court and it has your name on it.
‘Solatan vs Attys Inocentes and Camano:
On the basis of acts branded by the Integrated Bar of the Philippines (IBP) as “bordering on technical extortion,†accepting funds and giving unsolicited advice to an adverse party, and casting doubts as to the procedure of levy, the IBP resolved[1] to recommend the suspension of Atty. Camano from the practice of law for one (1) year.’
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:48 pm
cvj,
may the Lord bless your dad’s heart.
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:54 pm
who knows, Supremo could mean Supreme Court. You could be the scion of one those high magistrates who believe that they are God-like.
jcc on Wed, 24th Sep 2008 11:56 pm
even your quote is wrong. that is the ibp recommendation which was modified by the SC..
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 12:03 am
that’s the reason why you won’t reveal your credentials because they will expose your own bias… you are free to mouth your bias unimpeded by the right of the public to know where they come from while i have the simple courtesy of putting my name in my bias and the courage to face any personal diatribes from all sides. if we meet in person, i won’t even know that you are this blogger who suffers from verbal diarrhea and yet would look honorable enough in person.
supremo on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 12:04 am
jcc,
whatever extortionist.
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 12:07 am
in case you missed the memo jcc, this tambayan/pundtiry section which manolo graciously hosts is for the exchange of ideas not cv’s
we don’t need to see your credentials. you made a big fuss of it. with all these talk of ‘honor’ etc….
kaya nga payo ko, hire a good lawyer to get yourself reinstated.
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 12:19 am
not interested in getting reinstated.. quite frankly that affects only the stomach.. not the spirit.
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 12:35 am
nash,
you won’t reveal from what school you came from but you have shown your contempt over UP and Ateneo as diploma mills for lawyers and would excuse your failing to do so because this blog does not require exchange of cv’s. that’s not the point.. you consider UP and Ateneo as diploma mills and the public or bloggers are interested also in finding out your own if they can say the same thing of your own alma mater.
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 12:44 am
you were not listening i saw the law departments are diploma mills. eh di isama mo na san beda at ust law sa listahan.
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 12:45 am
mali type pa “said” instead of “saw”. apologies.
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 12:48 am
and pray, do tell, do we really need THAT many new lawyers each year??? Obvious naman na it’s just a revenue stream for these universities. Kaya sila Diploma mill.
Si Miriam nga, can’t find a lawyerly job at home kaya ayun, kasama si GMA holding bilateral meetings with Carribean islands not for our economic gain but so Miriam can get a job at the international courts.
anthony scalia on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 2:02 am
“Those who try to lawyer for themselves in court has a fool for a lawyer…â€
actually the exact quote is “Those who try to lawyer for themselves have a fool for a client”
anthony scalia on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 2:20 am
jcc,
since centennial naman ng UP nating mahal:
the meanings of the following acronyms:
ADMU – Aplikanteng Di Makapasok sa UP
DLSU – Di Lumusot Sa Upcat
UST – UP Sana Tayo
your new friend may have graduated from others
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 2:29 am
grabe, sobra naman kung di ka pa lumusot sa upcat eh multiple choice lang naman yun. eh nararapat lang na hindi ka dapat i-subsidise ng bayan.
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 3:28 am
“Si Miriam nga, can’t find a lawyerly job at home kaya ayun, kasama si GMA holding bilateral meetings with Carribean islands not for our economic gain but so Miriam can get a job at the international courts. Nash-
obvious ba na inggit ka dahil hindi ikaw ang binitbit ni GMA para makita ang Carribean? Magpakita ka muna ng “credentials tulad ni Miriam”.
tanong ko saiyo kung bumagsak ka ba sa UPCAT, sabi mo hindi mo type ang “multiple choice” – tanong ko ulit ano ba ang type mong exam at anong school mo, sagot mo ang cv mo ay isubmit mo lang kung mag-aaply ka ng trabaho at tipo namang hindi kita bibigyang ng trabaho.
UPCat is not only a multiple choice. it has reading and comprehension portion. (Atleast in Law).
Marami kang palusot hindi mo masabi ang school mo dahil ito iyong “others”.
hindi ka lang napakasok sa UP gusto mo ng alisan ito ng subsidy! ! !
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 3:30 am
i mean, “nakapasok”..
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 3:44 am
Please do not twist what I said.
I support UP subsidies pero kung pwede lang hwag sa Law School.
Jcc, I went to two schools that have been in existence since the 13th century.
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 3:55 am
yes, dahil 13th century na, bulok naito at hindi mo masabi ito iyong “others”.
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 3:57 am
dito ba sa 13th century schools mo my admission tests din, o “papogihan” lang and criteria?
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 4:06 am
Wala, interviews meron dahil they are not interested in exam results but ‘potentials’.
Anyways I did not have to go to UP to get here. I simply went to SLU in baguio then thought of going to UP pero mahal tumira sa manila tapos may BAYAD pa ang exam?? Our family cannot afford. So I went to another state school na libre pa.
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 4:15 am
nash, my nash,
that’s why i want you to read my book. i went to UP applied for grants. they granted me grants not because I am intelligent but because i am entitled to it being poor.
do not make your being poor as an excuse not to get the best education. it was an uphill battle, but i did not give up and i became a lawyer and I thank God and UP for giving me that education.
BrianB on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 4:21 am
Nash don’t tell you have a chip on the shoulder over not being able to get to UP. You’re from Oxford for God’s sake, the best uni in the world!
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 4:22 am
I am not making being poor as an excuse! It is simply expensive to live in Manila with a small grant and with no family in that huge metropolis.
It was easier for me to go to Cambridge, libre na lahat wala pa bayad ang application form.
I have three stacks of books I have not yet read next to my bed. Why would I want to read your love letters to the SC?
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 4:25 am
nash,
this is an entry in my book:
“In May 1974, fresh from college, I told my father that I was going to take up my law study in the University of the Philippines. I have already passed the UP college of law entrance test then. At that time my father was already retired from the government service and his monthly pension has yet to come.
He looked at me with sadness and bewilderment. A mixed feeling of fear and melancholy descended his face wrinkled not by age, but by too much exposure to hostile sun while working for years on the road as a “capataz”. I can read through the sadness in his face a fatherly feeling towards a son who could have thought that his son’s desire to take up a degree in law must have impaired his sanity for how
can a father retired from work and with no income, support a son’s education in law?
But my father did little realize that I was only asking for his permission and blessing to study law. I never have intended to burden him with the expense that came with it. As to my having finished law at a premier institution was a miracle and hard work, but more of a miracle”.
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 4:34 am
Listen, not to burst your story and all the flowery words but this is how it went
Me: Can we afford to live in Manila?
Father: No.
Me: Ok.
there was no melodrama. It was simply pragmatic. No sadness or bewilderment. This perhaps why I cannot write a book as yours.
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 4:41 am
if you were not able to get to UP but you get to Oxford that only means that its easier to get to Oxford than UP.
Not that I am belittling the American educational system. My daughter came to America at 6, she attended a private school in Quezon City. When she attended private school in America she was straight “A” student. She could hardly obtain “B’s” in her Quezon City school.
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 4:58 am
I did not even attempt to apply to UP as opposed to ‘not able to’. And yes it was indeed easier again to apply to Oxford. You simply wrote a letter (avoiding the superflous melodrama and mentioning the bewilderment of papa) and got interviewed. In fact, it is also simple to apply to Harvard too, online application at Libre pa.
Anyways, enough of your requirement to flash credentials hokey. It’s irrelevant. It’s not where you came from, it’s where you are going. (naks, cliche bell)
And I simply have very little regard for lawyers. At hindi ako naiinggit kay Miriam at nagmamaka-awa siya sa mga Carib countries para iboto siya sa ICC. Don’t take it personally.
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 5:04 am
did you apply at harvard and were you accepted? – no, i don’t take it personally.. i have no regards for lawyers too… specially the bad ones…
Letran student on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 5:12 am
I can see that mang jcc believes may miscarriage of justice. Pero nasaan? Sa pagkabasa ko, si Soltana (the renter) ay hindi naman influence-peddling multi-millionaire. Hindi siya politician, hindi general’s wife, hindi kabit ng congressman. Mala namang binanggit si jcc na nangsuhol iyong si Soltana. She was the renter (and she wanted her oven back). Mukha talagang sa tingin ni Soltana, niloko siya. Sa galit, she sued. IBP investigated. Soltana won. Mang jcc got disbarred. Suspendido isang taon.
Ano ang nangyari doon sa oven? nagsolian naman siguro.
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 5:15 am
no, because they said I was not from UP
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 5:16 am
now it is you who were doing the melodrama. you did not desire to study at UP because of the fee of the exam and the cost of the metropolis but you spent money for your fare to Cambridge, and don’t tell me that you spend zero money while in Cambridge.
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 5:18 am
so had you been from UP, you could have been accepted at Harvard, is that the chip on your shoulder?
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 5:20 am
letran,
Solatan not Soltana. Read the case again. If you miss even the name of the complainant, you could have missed a lot of things also.
if you are unlike nash, you can read the motions for reconsiderations. otherwise… just make a conclusion the same way the SC did.. does not matter….
BrianB on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 5:35 am
JCC,
Philippine schools have an odd way of grading. A straight-A student from a US school will have trouble getting passing grades in my high school. They had us memorize a bad translation of Rizal’s Noli and Fili. The questionnaires go something like this. Fill in the blanks:
1. Mula sa bintana, natanaw niya ang isang —– sa kabila ng ilog. Naririnig niya ang kalansing ng mga kubyertos at pinggan. Dinig din niya ang tugtugin ng orkestra.
I mean, Jesus Christ, the teacher didn’t even warns us that we needed to memorize the novel verbatim.
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 5:42 am
@jcc
I spent ZERO of my own money at Cambridge. UP does not provide sufficient funds. (which is a shame) so the pragmatic thing is to go to where you study without a hungry stomach.
And try to detect sarcasm with the UP-Harvard comment hokey. You should know figure of speech well especially with your palanca-worthy book. I’m waiting for the movie adaptation.
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 5:58 am
brianB,
too bad brianB, but in my high school we were never asked to memorize Noli and Fili but to paraphrase the meaning of the paragraphs in those books.
we were asked to memorize the passages of Florante at Laura.. it was nice though because memorizing Florante is like memorizing a song. The rhyme and color of the lines were simply perfect and the Florante’s struggle in the woods and his heart’s desire are simply original and you can identify yourself with his travails, hardships and woes.
i remember my mother who said that in elementary grades they were being made to memorize “Ibong Adarna” .. Yes, this is an odd way we teach our children in school and the way we grade them… but the best thing about those exercise is that we develop discipline in us… to be able to memorize them, you have to read them and spend time on them. it may not develop in us our reasoning prowess but only the ability to memorize.. but this way of grading and teaching i think is no longer with us today.
BrianB on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 6:00 am
Pati ba plane ticket papunta bayad. Nash, kala ko oxford ka di cambridge.
Anyone, really hope Manolo clears up a few topics like what’s up with Villar. I have to read several papers lately because Quezon.ph has no post on this thing.
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 6:04 am
if you were sarcastic, i was not. if you said that it was easy getting to Harvard because all you have to do is to apply. so i asked if you apply and was admitted.. if you say so, why cambridge instead of harvard?
BrianB on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 6:06 am
JCC, the test included essays, too, that test your grasp of the narrative of Noli and Fili, but there’s like 50 points on memorization included in the test. The teacher was probably very sadistic or grossly misguided.
Never a fan of Florante and Laura and rhyme and meter in Tagalog is easy.
BrianB on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 6:25 am
About UPCAT,
The easiest test I ever took. I even made bola with an assumptionista test taker, who offered me her cupcake during the break.
The ateneo test was a lot harder, I didn’t finish the test.
I was number 60 in a class of 100.
Thirteen passed diliman, 8 passed AdMU.
I went to AdMU.
My IQ, IQ is the most reliable measure of intelligence we have, is the same as Ted Bundy’s IQ. I’m not proud of this. I was only the third highest in my HS batch after one result of an IQ test.
In Ateneo, met several people with a higher IQ than me, or so they said. One guy was 6 foot 2, 15 years old(already a freshman in college), has a standing offer from Princeton (fully paid)… he had an IQ of 180+. I beat him in chess and fencing.
A few years ago, my mother told me her IQ. I was shamefaced. She is a lowly math teacher but her IQ score is way up the charts – at least, higher than mine. My father, I suspect, probably has a two-digit IQ but that may only be good old oedipus complex on my part. I don’t have the highest IQ in my family. My lolo’s brother had a perfect score throughout college. Perfect. 100%. No mistakes. He’s a lawyer in some far flung province, mildly successful.
Okay, tapos na ang istorya. Next time, IQ nalang i post natin para wala na puro satsat.
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 6:26 am
@jcc
because it’s easier to do weekends in Paris (by bus pa) when you are in Oxbridge rather than in Boston? I think this is a good enough reason. I simply prefer the liberal European lifestyle.
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 6:36 am
HOY brianB
NEVER EVER use the word “lowly” next to math+teacher! those are two very important fields.
Have you been in touch with Chiz Escudero (that idjot senator who wanted to cut down basic math and science subjects?)
BrianB on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 6:45 am
lowly as in low wage earner. Btw, why do you keep offering up decoys. Cambridge ba or Oxford?
leytenian on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 6:47 am
GOLD VS DOLLAR
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6NfXk7Bvc8&feature=related
The GOLD STANDARD
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Uce1Md4ZcQ&feature=related
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 6:56 am
@brian
oo nga pala. i missed the ‘lowly’ to refer to wage. kainis especially when one sees how overpaid lawyers are.
I went to both state universities. I’m an eternal student because I’m too nice and honest to be an investment banker.
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 7:27 am
nash,
so you were trying to bash UP and Ateneo as diploma mills for lawyers because you want to flash your credentials as Oxford grad?
i get it…
leytenian on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 8:05 am
The Philippine Supreme Court rank 6th among the most Corrupt Judicial System in Asia.
What a shame….
“In the September 23, 2008 Transparency International Corruption Perceptions Index (global survey ranking countries in terms of perceived corruption), the Philippines dropped to 141st, down 10 places from 2007, among 180 countries surveyed. It scored a 2.3 in the Corruption Perceptions Index (CPI), lower than 2007’s 2.5, on a scale where 10 is the highest possible grade. Vincent Lazatin, TI executive director, said: “We are compared to our nearest neighbors Thailand, Malaysia, Indonesia and Vietnam, with Vietnam seen as eventually overtaking us in a few years. The difference is that (in other countries) when business sets aside money to grease the wheels, they know that they will get what they paid for. In the Philippines, there is no certainty”
cvj on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 1:13 pm
FYI…The Myth of ‘g’. IQ as a measure of intelligence is a myth.
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 2:33 pm
@jcc
nope. you brought that up. kasi nga ano ba ang tawag sa department na tanggap ng tanggap ng lawyers eh sobra sobra na ang lawyers? pray do tell, do we really need more lawyers nga eh?
and naghahahanap ka ng credentials dahil sa tingin mo invalid ang opinion ng iba dahil anonymous sila or from the ‘others’ sila whereas pinangalandakan mo ang CV mo complete with lifestory with post of your autobiography with the corny metaphors ek-ek.
and truth be told, kaya naman siguro inignore ng SC ang petition/motion/hwatever mo (yes, i finally read it) dahil it reads more like a novel that maybe should have ended up with the Palanca judges. Now, there is money to be made in literature so go for it.
i
BrianB on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 6:42 pm
cvj,
mas myth naman siguro na lahat nang UPCAT passers may talino, diba?
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 7:20 pm
nash,
You write with sarcasm, you insult people, you are judgmental, you bashed UP, Ateneo including San Beda and UST as diploma mills for your lawyers, and you insult Miriam Santiago.
Don’t you ever think for a moment that you can mesmerize and bully me of your Oxford credential. If you hate Miriam so much because she could not find a lawyerly job, she too has an Oxford credential or any high sounding foreign school credential.
You are better off had you just went to UP. My blog is “One Prism, Varied Color†is indicative of my philosophy that different people looking through one medium can see different colors. I don’t insult people unless I am insulted first, and I don’t resort to “ad hominems†and do not call people “monkeys†with cognitive deficit because they happened to disagree with me. I encourage people to speak out their mind even if they are different than mine because that is what democracy all about.
p.s.
and what is your basis in saying that there are too many lawyers in the country? and assuming it has, what is your right to demand that the right of individual to be whatever he wants to be should be curtailed.. do you really understand the meaning of liberty and freedom?
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 7:28 pm
nash,
wheewww. you read my motions.. what a lie!. i have my dashboard and I can monitor every page that is being accessed from my blog. noone has accessed my two motions for the last 2 days.
leytenian on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 7:45 pm
nash.
“do we really need more lawyers nga eh?”
yes we do. to create good ones, the Philippines must create competition in services. Law practice in our country do not reflect the quality of theory. we need lawyers to represent the people at the lowest possible level from human rights violation, welfare, and many more.
The Fact: the result of actual practice and application of theory is that the Philippine Judicial system is ranked 6th among the most corrupt in Asia.
therefore, the IQ of those who are in the Justice System is a MYTH. as cvj mention, IQ as a measure of intelligence is a Myth.
In Management: How do you create demand of quality service? How do you implement it?
I agree with jcc. He is happy where he is in Michigan with family.
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 9:00 pm
@jcc
I clicked every link on your blog. so unless there is another motion out there that i do not know of…
Rodolfo on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 9:02 pm
to jcc: I still do not see that you are being persecuted. I do not see where you have gotten on the bad side of the of some Philippine senator nor a local government official nor a millionaire.
sa tingin ko, jcc second big mistake was having a poor lawyer defend him when Solatan on 1 August 1988 filed the “instant administrative case for disbarment against Atty. Inocentes and Atty. Camano”. jcc lost the case. His subsequent motions for reconsideration also failed. End-result : jose camano lost the presumption of innocence, lost his license to practice because he was suspended for one year.
third mistake — jcc failure to know that a lawyer who has been suspended does not automatically get reinstated at the end of the suspension period. [The lawyer has to request for reinstatement.]
fourth mistake : jcc should also have known that not being “a lawyer in good standing” in the Philippines messes up his application to the california bar. This mistake — failure at reinstatement — resulted in the Philippine Supreme Court responding to a California Bar background check on jcc. The GOP Supreme Court stated the obvious — that jcc had been suspended, and that jcc remains suspended. California Bar does a review of applicant moral character. The California Bar “evaluates whether an applicant possesses the qualities of honesty, fairness, candor, trustworthiness, observance of fiduciary responsibility, respect for and obedience to the laws of the state and the nation, and respect for the rights of others and for the judicial process.”
So how long with “failure to get reinstated” get in the way of jcc getting a USA law license? This webpage may shed light.
http://www.calbar.ca.gov/calbar/pop-html/admissions_factors-moral-char.html
among its statements (on acts of misconduct, etc:
…. an applicant who has committed such acts must demonstrate rehabilitation prior to certification for admission. . . .
It is the policy of The State Bar of California that persons who have been convicted of violent felonies, felonies involving moral turpitude and crimes involving a breach of fiduciary duty are presumed not to be of good moral character in the absence of a pardon or a showing of overwhelming reform and rehabilitation. The Committee shall exercise its discretion to determine whether applicants convicted of violent felonies, felonies involving moral turpitude and crimes involving a breach of fiduciary duty have produced overwhelming proof of reform and rehabilitation, including at a minimum, a lengthy period of not only unblemished, but exemplary conduct.
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 9:07 pm
@jcc
I am an EQUAL opportunities employer. I bash EVERYONE and ANYONE including myself. And besides, I make no apologies for my gutter humour. I’m a nice person. I don’t get physical.
Two: Of course people can go become lawyers if they want. I am simply saying my opinion that we have too many. And that they contribute negatively to the GDP as many studies (not found in blogs but in journals) show.
And three, who is bullying who? You ask for credentials first before you can process information? I have no intention of bullying anyone. Eh ikaw nagwawagayway ng CV mo eh di sinagot ko lang tanong mo.
And don’t worry about miriam, she can take the insults, kahit harap-harapan pa.
cheers and welcome to the happy word of the internets.
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 9:09 pm
and why are you so pikon, I have a whole load of assumptionista jokes….would it be more or less funnier had I gone to assumption?
Rodolfo on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 9:10 pm
to jcc: And there is a ready path to getting resolution. First step —– start the paperwork for reinstatement.
And do not let another requirement further complicate things. “Continuing education” (so many units every so many years) is a requirement for lawyers to retain their license to practice law.
My humble opinion……….
nash on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 9:13 pm
@jcc
also, you can put ten counters or monitors on your blog but there are ways to visit your blog anonymously without leaving an IP trace or tripping your counter. ano tingin mo sa akin, nakikigamit ng AMA computer?
supremo on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 9:21 pm
jcc to nash:
‘You write with sarcasm, you insult people, you are judgmental, you bashed UP, Ateneo including San Beda and UST as diploma mills for your lawyers, and you insult Miriam Santiago.’
This observation came from someone who extorts money for a living.
nash,
I have to read your Miranda rights before you divulge more information to jcc.
‘You have the right to remain silent and refuse to answer questions. Do you understand?
Anything you do say may be used against you in a court of law. Do you understand?
You have the right to consult an attorney before speaking to the police and to have an attorney present during questioning now or in the future. Do you understand?
If you cannot afford an attorney, one will be appointed for you before any questioning if you wish. Do you understand?
If you decide to answer questions now without an attorney present you will still have the right to stop answering at any time until you talk to an attorney. Do you understand?
Knowing and understanding your rights as I have explained them to you, are you willing to answer my questions without an attorney present?’
Rodolfo on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 9:23 pm
nash: pinag-praktisan ka lang ni jcc. Those lawyerly skills in argumentation / presentation of evidence and “stuff”that resulted in you needing to say to jcc
…Please do not twist what I said.
Master Yoda on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 9:31 pm
@ Nash,
So your an Oxford shire bloke, mate? Be careful not to sound too much of an English gentleman lest the anti-elite brigade gonna get ya.
I believe that where you are now, the subjects of your attack are called Solicitors (or Advocates). Yes, Sir Nash?:)
BrianB on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 9:49 pm
The Philippine integrated bar never contributed to justice, never. They are worse than incompetent doctors. one sure sign of their uselessness is that the masa are afraid of lawyers. Is this fear justice? Fucking NO!
BrianB on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 9:51 pm
Not to insult individual lawyers. Most of my paternal cousins are lawyers, my brother is a lawyer, family expected me to become a lawyer… but fact is, lawyers are known instruments of the corrupt and the oppressors and even good lawyers enjoy this status… that is, as the pit bulls of society.
BrianB on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 9:53 pm
“Be careful not to sound too much of an English gentleman lest the anti-elite brigade gonna get ya. ”
Have no fear of this. Just read Nash’s blog.
BrianB on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 9:57 pm
One way to address injustice is to put caps on retainers in criminal cases. An even more extreme scenario: have lawyers’ names picked randomly for criminal cases. Yes, a lawyer lottery. Magdasal nalang kayo, whether you are poor or rich. This mantra: every man has a right to get the best lawyer he can afford. This is bullshit. No idea who said this but it is bullshit. Mas maganda pa yung medieval trial by ordeal.
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 10:00 pm
nash, rodolfo, supremo,
it is nice to hear legal arguments from non-lawyers.
If I am proud of my school because it taught me three simple things: logic, decency and good manners. You may find them hard to believe yet I shall honor your belief.
Nash, let us analyze your Oxfordian training.
You said:
and naghahahanap ka ng credentials dahil sa tingin mo invalid ang opinion ng iba dahil anonymous sila or from the ‘others’ sila whereas pinangalandakan mo ang CV mo complete with lifestory with post of your autobiography with the corny metaphors ek-ek.”.
I ask where you graduated from only in relation with your claim that UP, Ateneo, UST, San Beda are diploma mills for lawyers. The bloggers are entitled to know where you from because your school could be another one of those diploma mills you decried about. That is all to it. I am not saying that your opinion is invalid, all i am asking is for your to give us your school because it could be another “diploma mill school”. ‘ If you still l cannot absorb the argument – maybe that Oxford degree means nothing at all.
Supremo,
I ask for your credential because you had been defending SC and had been bashing me. So I thought that Supremo could be analogous to Supreme Court and I wanted to know if you are a magistrate or a scion of one. Because if you are either, I could understand the bias to defend the Supreme Court. That is all to it. I do not argue about the invalidity of your opinion, only interested in your credential so we can telegraph your bias.
Rodolfo,
You have cited a lot of authorities and even cited the California Bar rules.. But you missed the point though that says California may exercised its discretion if applicant convicted of those offenses show rehabilitation, etc…. So your step one step two can be bypassed.
As I said, I do not call anyone stupid, tanga, monkey nor I have insulted someone who insulted me and if ever I have traded insult with insult, my apology.
supremo on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 10:21 pm
Tatang jcc,
Baka nakalimutan niyo na kayo ang nagkalat ng buhay nito rito. Kayo rin po ang nagdidiin na ang Supreme Court ay mali sa kanilang hatol sa inyo. Hindi ko kahit minsan sinabing pumapanig ako sa SC dahil hindi ko naman kailangan pumanig sa kahit kanino man sa inyo. Kung nag-aral po talaga kayo ng logic baka kailangan niyong ulitin uli at mukhang nakalimutan niyo na. Natatandaan niyo pa ba ang unang pangungusap na isinulat ko dito? Basahin niyo ulit.
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 10:34 pm
supremo,
excuse me. it was nash. i told nash just to read my blog because i cannot do a synopsis here.
but that is water under the bridge now. just stick to the point.. if you believe SC infallible, and it can be God-like, as i said I have no problem with that.
BUT there are people like me and like Thomas Jefferson who said that it is not infallible. In fact Thomas Jeffersion said that the SC can even pervert the constituion, and therefore it can pervert the meaning of “EXTORTION”.
just consult a lawyer before you make a legal argument because we are getting ridiculous here.
BrianB on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 10:36 pm
JCC, the term is Oxonian. Ewan ko ba bakit napaka anonymous ni Nash. Baka maraming naghahabol.
jcc on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 10:37 pm
supremo,
btw.. “can pervert the meaning of Extortion” is my conclusion over the statement of T Jefferson that the SC can pervert the constitution.
supremo on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 10:55 pm
jcc,
‘just consult a lawyer before you make a legal argument because we are getting ridiculous here’
whatever tatang.
UP n grad on Thu, 25th Sep 2008 11:57 pm
to pilipinoparin: In case you did not pick up on it, all the discussions on Solatan vs Inocentes provides a weapon to use against abusive lawyers.
The next time a lawyer yells and screams and threatens that lightning from the heavens will strike if you don’t do X or I don’t do Y and because you broke section-3/paragraph-2/sub-paragraph-3.2.b, of course you argue and plead your case. Then ask this lawyer for advise on what you can do. Then give that lawyer a check payable in his name, and if you can give him a sack of rice or an electric fan, that is also good. Then three weeks later (after you have verified that the check has been cashed), sue to get the electric fan back. Also to have him disbarred. The check you gave for lawyer-advise he should not have taken because he can’t serve two masters at the same time. Reason that you gave him the check ???? You’re not a lawyer, you would not know second-order-derivative from limbic limbic. But state clearly that you felt obligated to give the check. He was confusing you, he was threatening you. He wanted you to pay something now!!! The investigator from IBP will probably uncover Solatan versus Inocentes and the term “technical extortion”.
Anthony Scalia or any duly-licensed lawyer in the Philippines, your comment will be appreciated. Tama ba?
UP n grad on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 12:15 am
Obviously, what I just postulated will not work against lawyers who meticulously follow procedures (e.g. due diligence when handling checks and payments intended for the client.)
anthony scalia on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 12:39 am
UP n,
in deference to a companyero and a fellow UP Law alumnus, i inhibit myself from making a comment
jcc on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 12:45 am
hohooum…. another non-lawyer arguing legal points.. good luck…
jcc on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 12:49 am
not you anthony, i am referring to UP n grad.
BrianB on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 1:02 am
“UP n,
in deference to a companyero and a fellow UP Law alumnus, i inhibit myself from making a comment”
Damn. I should’ve inhibited myself too. Para feeling.
UP n grad on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 1:18 am
jcc: So do you think my scenario will work even against a lawyer who meticulously follows procedures? How does a lawyer protect himself from getting entangled in the likes of Solatan versus Inocentes?
jcc on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 1:31 am
Up N grad,
Just for a legit court to look into the facts and apply the law.. as I said, i was implmenting a valid court order, therefore there was no extortion..
.. i do not have the gas stove because it was under custodia legis.. 
UP n grad on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 1:33 am
From my point of view (and this is from the point of view of a property-owner, not a lawyer) as soon as there was a sheriff’s order to evict the tenants, then to execute the eviction. The tenant already had a flaky payment history so the sooner the landlord-tenant relationship gets terminated, the better. Evict the tenant, then analyze if it is worthwhile to hire a collection-agency to retrieve any and all unpaid rent.
jcc on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 1:36 am
the oven/stove if you read the record is clear enough it was turned over to the caretaker of the apartment, Mr. Esberto Recto after the sheriff returned all the items to Mr. Solatan. Mr. Solatan was not able to present his ownership over the stove nor did he bother presenting a receipt because either it was non-serviceable anymore or that the stove could realy belonged to his sister who left the apartment with P60,000 unpaid rentals. I am not really comfortable arguing these points here because Supremo might get balistic again.
jcc on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 1:38 am
leytenian,
only 6th rank? watch it side down..
UP n grad on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 1:50 am
jcc: I can easily imagine where Solatan-the-tenant was a dog. A really bad tenant, in arrears for over 6 months. Now I as landlord won’t negotiate with a bad tenant — kick them out my mantra. But I can imagine that Inocentes and/or Camano actually tried to be helpful to Solatan (e.g. for Solatan to true up on the payments in order for Solatan to remain as tenant).
Then things went berserk, and the dog-tenant bit the hand that tried to help. UNFORTUNATELY, there were appearances of impropriety. The dog-tenant drew blood. IBP-investigator made conclusion of improper actions by Inocentes-and-Camano.
[Disclosure: don't know any of the names or the personages in the Solatan-vs-Inocentes&Camano. One or all of them may be saints for all I know. ]
UP n grad on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 1:51 am
Mental note to myself —- kick the dog out, no re-negotiation still A-okay as business practice.
supremo on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 2:06 am
jcc,
‘Supremo might get balistic again’
Psychic ka tatang? Pikon ka talaga. Nilalagyan mo lang ng emoticon para hindi halata.
Oo nga pala. Huwag mong sabihan na non-lawyer si UP n grad . Nakalimutan mo na non-lawyer ka rin.
Kailan matatapos ang drama mo sa blog ni mlq3? Pakiusap lang pwede huwag mong buhayin na sa susunod na entry ni mlq3. OA na kasi.
Pilipinoparin on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 2:25 am
“in deference to a companyero and a fellow UP Law alumnus, i inhibit myself from making a comment’….Scalia
Ooooopppps! Mababawasan yata ang paghanga ko ko kay Anthony.Kala ko walang sinasanto ang mabuting lawyers?
jcc on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 2:48 am
supremo,
kung hindi ka nakakalata, ikaw ang OA. Just make an intelligent comment, no personalities please ! !
UP N grad,
1986, PCGG sequestered the 100-unit apartments. Issued memo to tenants to direct their payments to PCGG. NO tenants paid PCGG.
PCCG authorized our firm as lawyer for the landords to sue non-paying tenants. PCGG cannot sue tenants because the issue of ownership of the apartments was being litigated in Sandiganbayan. Gliceria was sued but has long vacated the premises. George and mother occupied the apartment. When served with eviction notice, mother-son tandem went to our office to offer to pay the unpaid rents (P60,000). Believing in good faith that non-payment was caused by the legal hiatus, the offer on installment was accepted.
50% of attorneys pay in accordance with the executory decision was paid and P1,000 sheriffs’ cost.
Mother-son promised to pay arrears.
No payment was made. Execution was implemented. Mother-son begged that they were willing to pay. Issued 4 postdated checks, One was cashed second bounced. Final eviction was triggered with the second check bounced.
UP N,
Just read my blog. its all there.
supremo on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 3:43 am
jcc,
‘Just make an intelligent comment’
jcc’s intelligent comments:
‘Just read my blog. its all there.’
‘there was no extortion..
.’
‘another non-lawyer arguing legal points’
‘wheewww. you read my motions.. what a lie!. i have my dashboard and I can monitor every page that is being accessed from my blog. noone has accessed my two motions for the last 2 days.’
‘if you were not able to get to UP but you get to Oxford that only means that its easier to get to Oxford than UP.’
supremo on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 3:52 am
jcc,
Paalala lang po tatang. Nakalimutan niyo na sinabi niyo ito.
‘i have my own blog to take care of my fighting.’
supremo on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 4:02 am
jcc,
‘no personalities please ! !’
sabi mo kay The Cat.
‘Is showbiz, another one of your forte, aside from being a financial whiz, accounting whiz and “ad hominem whiz?’
leytenian on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 6:57 am
jcc,
number 1 corrupt ata ang justice system few years back but they have improved as corrupt… hahahah
nash on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 3:48 pm
Jcc I offer my legal services to you:
Let me write your motion:
My client, Jcc, esq, has served his suspension of 1 year from the practice of law for technical extortion. Having no further legal obstacles, my client demands his reinstatement into the roll of lawyers. Period.
Oh ayan, we did a motion in two lines. The SC is NOT infallible but do you think they are interested to hear about your lifestory na irrelevant? They are important and real cases to handle too you know.
We also saved some trees. Kaya you should feel good about it.
AND…
“another non-lawyer arguing legal points”
coming from a lawyer is further proof that lawyers make laws in jargon and flowery words to protect their scum of a profession. kaya nga may “simple english” campaign in most countries so that lawyers will be forced to use direct language para maintindihan ng lahat. pero siempre, ayaw ng mga dinosaur lawyers dahil bebenta mga signature nila.
if you need a lawyer to understand the law, it’s badly written.
nash on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 3:52 pm
and jcc, we are all guilty of ad hominem. I raise my hand and admit it. (It’s quite fun!)
but when you say someone cannot argue a point of law dahil hindi sila lawyer, ano yon?
or if you ask for credentials before you process information, ano yon?
Irony!.
Ad hominem, fun, fun, fun, pikon talo.
cheers
nash on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 5:18 pm
@master yoda
I am not and english bloke . I am an igorot who one day came down from the boondocks.
I am all for “elitism” (as long as it does not refer to material wealth). We should all strive to the be ‘elite’ in whatever field of endeavour we choose.
@supremo,
tara hiking muna tayo sa rockies. medyo sirang plaka na si tatang. hanggang ngayon kasi kapit kapit pa niya transcript of records niya eh ilang dekada nakalipas. si hajii alejandro pa yata ‘kilabot ng kolehiyala’ noon.
nash on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 5:40 pm
@leytenian
“….yes we do. to create good ones”
So you want more lawyers in the hope that of the x number of applicants, a potential 0.001x will turn out to be good??? And you think the practice of law will be better because many mediocre ones are in competition??? Did it ever occur to you that maybe, just maybe, the sheer number of mediocre lawyers in circulation contributes to the corruption you cite??? I think you have stumbled into a novel theory of efficiency there….
jcc on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 9:20 pm
NASH
or if you ask for credentials before you process information, ano yon? Irony – — NASH
Again you cannot process the argument. I ask for your credential just to find out if you did not graduate from the same school you consider diplma mills for lawyers – Apparently you did not, because you are an Oxford grad, that’s the reason why you bashed some schools who accepted law students as “diploma mills”.
But if you take a good look at it, your Oxford degree means nothing to me, and quite frankly you are better off with a UP degree. You write with sarcasm, you insult people, you show your disgust to Miriam Santiago who is also your co-alumnus, you bashed Philippine schools you did not come from. Should I envy your Oxford credential, no sir! ! !
As i said, i do not trade insult with insult and if I ever did, I apologized. If you read Cat’s “ad hominem” imputed to me, you will consider my response mild and not provocative.
If you read your own and Supremo’s diatribes, you will again find out that my response is not vitriolic as yours.
Again if you want to argue legal poiints, good luck, but you cannot blame me for saying that as a matter of simple humility, non-lawyers must not be made to argue legal points.
Ad hominem
jcc on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 9:26 pm
nash,
if you look at the list of lawyers in attorneys’ rolls from the SC website, you can still find my name there.
so as my attorney, you cannot ask the SC to restore my name to the roll of attorney because in the first place it has not been stricken off.
need i say more that non-lawyers should not be allowed to argue legal point?
nash on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 9:55 pm
jcc
ok. so you can practice law pa pala. pasensiya ka na, confusing kasi ipnaglalaban mo. kung ano ano kasi, alam mo naman, nakakalito.
mea maxima culpa.
so para ano pa yang mga love letters natin kay justice puno? corrupt ang sc dahil nahuli kang namamangka sa dalawang ilog??
is that a legal point? that’s more like an ethics point….hmmm i hope you cooked a lot of nice meals with that super kalan you ‘borrowed’.
and why should ‘association with miriam that prevent me from bashing her? i do not have a tribal mentality. . i can also criticise my own school, which in fact i do.
i’m not shoving my degree at you, it’s you who is doing that to yourself. duh, hello, wake up, i stated it as a matter of fact and not to cause you envy.
i know, i did something wrong there. i accept that. when chris rock makes blacks/nigger jokes it’s very funny, when a redneck makes black/nigger jokes it’s still funny but he will probably end up in jail/ostracized for inciting racism..
i made a up joke and i am not from up. so there.
and why are you so pikon? are you still part of the up cheer squad? last i checked, you graduated when my father did not yet consummate his lust on my mother. moove on, that’s decades ago, you are no longer poor, stop making a big sentimenal fuss.
do not begrudge me for not liking lawyers, in the whole history of the human race, lawyers have never had a positive popularity rating for many valid reasons. i have lots of lawyer friends and I love them but I know when the rapture comes, they will all burn in hell along with the fornicators and supporters of the rh bill.
jcc on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 10:16 pm
nash,
lincoln and jefferson are lawyers and are well-venerated. the “rotten apples” in the profession should not be taken as an argument for despising lawyers, which you claim this representation is one.
but i cannot quite comprehend why would everybody would want to go to a school whose best by-product finds it fun and exciting insulting people.
i am proud of my school because we do not have as a curriculum “ad hominem” 101. and I am profuse in my apology if I have insulted anyone in this site.
UP n grad on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 10:22 pm
to jcc: California Bar website says
* July 2008 California Bar Examination Results will be mailed to applicants on Friday, November 21, 2008. Results will be available online to applicants only on Friday, November 21, 6 p.m. Results will be available online to the public on Sunday, November 23, 6 a.m.
Good luck to you!!! I hope that the letter from IntegBarPhilippines to the California Bar suffices and the “moral character” California requirement gets resolved in your favor.
==========================
nash: and may they burn in hell the pedophiles. Also the aggressors in non-consensual sex.
nash on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 10:59 pm
jcc
jefferson is the same man who said “free the slaves” yet kept slaves of his own?
what a very apt analogy for ‘namamangka sa dalawang ilog’. you know your history well. i give you that.
nash on Fri, 26th Sep 2008 11:18 pm
@UP n
I’m writing a new tv pilot, it’s a workplace drama about a very brilliant lawyer who represents both the prosecution and the defense in some yet unnamed Islands country.
I’m developing the character at the moment. He has very honest intentions but cannot process certain bits of information.
I wonder if you know of any experts I can hire as consultants or better yet a middle aged actor who has the gravitas of hugh laurie. It will be ten times full of sarcasm and insults and witty banter and it’s a very physical role because the character has to run across the court as he lawyers for both parties.
ta.
that’s it. I need to disengage myself from this and go back to my cave for a bit.
UP n grad on Sat, 27th Sep 2008 1:14 am
to nash: I still wish that jcc can state the equivalent of “put a condom on” — one or two words-of-wisdom to current and future lawyers so that they do not get caught into a future Solatan-vs-Inocentes case. Again, it is obvious to me that the plaintiff was not some high-handed politician or millionaire or influence-peddler.
But – - – - “disengage” makes sense.
leytenian on Sat, 27th Sep 2008 6:50 am
nash,
“Did it ever occur to you that maybe, just maybe, the sheer number of mediocre lawyers in circulation contributes to the corruption you cite??? I think you have stumbled into a novel theory of efficiency there….”
supply and demand is not a novel theory. when there’s oversupply of lawyers in our country, services charge will be cheap and quality of service is what the consumers will eventually pay. that’s what efficiency of market in the service sector is all about. same thing with products.
in our current system , people cannot get a good lawyer. we don’t have a government subsidies service that will allow individual to hire a lawyer at a low price. No one represents our people. Most of the corrupt lawyers, represent the corporation and to hide the government’s fault.
there’s a big gap between practice and needs. How many lawyers in a given population ( philippines 85 million people) should compete for quality and price of service?
The Singapore government is attempting to address the shortage with moves like setting up a new law school within the Singapore Management University, increasing the intake for the National University of Singapore (NUS) law faculty and allowing foreign firms and lawyers to practice in the country. Courses include business and corporate law, intellectual property law, financial law and regulation and a variety of others including a course in ethics and social responsibility. The first students were accepted last August.
“The law is being routinely and blatantly abused for political purposes,†Singapore, he says, “has turned into a lawless country, a country run according to the pleasure of Lee Kuan Yew; not according to law. A legal system where if you knew the identities of the litigants, you can predict the outcome of the trial with absolute accuracy. That is if Lee Kuan Yew or his family were parties to an action, the outcome of the litigation is known even before you step into court! Lee wins. Hapless opponent loses.â€
http://www.asiasentinel.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1109&Itemid=34
anthony scalia on Sun, 28th Sep 2008 5:46 pm
Pilipinoparin :
“Ooooopppps! Mababawasan yata ang paghanga ko ko kay Anthony.Kala ko walang sinasanto ang mabuting lawyers?”
in due time i might comment
Pilipinoparin on Mon, 29th Sep 2008 1:07 am
Iyan ang tunay na Scalia, right is right, freedom is freedom. Walang kamag-anak, ka-frat, co alums, ka-tribo, kabalen o ka-Manong. I am hoping many lawyers and politicians would be like you.
Pilipinoparin on Mon, 29th Sep 2008 1:15 am
I should have added…Sagasaan ang dapat sagasaan.Saka wala ring makikialam na Ninong.
liz on Wed, 1st Oct 2008 2:57 pm
what the fuck.