Subscribe to Manuel L. Quezon III: The Daily DoseNews FeedSubscribe to Manuel L. Quezon III: The Daily DoseComments

Communal political vocabulary wanted

July 30, 2007 by mlq3  
Filed under Daily Dose

Leave a comment

The weekend saw a lot of speculation concerning the President’s decision to move Neda Director-General Romulo Neri to the Commission on Higher Education, a decision that apparently took Neri himself by surprise. Most of the speculation involved the motives: was it to get Neri out of the way, because he opposed the ZTE broadband deal? Was it part of a purge of Speaker Jose de Venecia’s people in the Palace?  The implications of other presidential appointments, too, has been the grist of the political rumor mill: reports like Overhaul in gov’t continues help identify the president’s priorities, and incidentally, feeds discussion on why certain positions are quickly filled (by the usual suspects) and others left vacant.

The Neri transfer has created its own problems, though: So who’s the real education czar?

Education Secretary Jesli Lapus Sunday said there was a need to clarify an executive order designating a presidential assistant as coordinator of the
Department of Education (DepEd), Commission on Higher Education (CHEd) and the Technical Education and Skills Development Authority (TESDA).

The executive order was seen in some sectors as tantamount to appointing a de facto education czar.

“There is already an existing presidential assistant for education. And I don’t think you can call a presidential assistant a czar,” Lapus said in a phone interview.

He said he was not consulted about the executive order.

Some however, view the Neri move as a good one, including The Business Mirror editorial:

Finally, officials have seen the irony of the OFWs’ situation: as recently pointed out in a front-page story in this paper, the more dollars they remit home, the bigger the gap that has to be filled in their families’ usual budget—given that with the peso appreciating in the flood of dollars, their dollar earnings here fetch an increasingly lower peso equivalent.

A couple of OFW dependents interviewed for that Associated Press story said that in a matter of a few months, the difference in the peso equivalent of the dollars sent home by their OFW loved ones had reached P3,000 to P5,000. To make up for that decline, some OFWs have thus had to remit more, thus perpetuating the cycle.

We’re talking here of about eight million overseas Filipinos whose aggregate remittances as of April were up 26.08 percent to $4.681 billion.

This editorial reminds me of a rather depressing conversation over the weekend.

It involved an observation someone made, which goes like this. It can’t be denied that for big business, business is pretty damned good. And for some other businesses, involving small and medium scale entrepreneurs, etc., it’s pretty good, too. And the export of our fellow citizens overseas makes our economy pretty much foolproof, regardless of who is in charge of our government.

But, the person making the observation said, think of it. You’re an OFW. You earn a salary, and you remit a big chunk of it home. You send it through a bank owned by big business, which takes a cut. Your family at home takes the money you sent (minus the bank’s cut), and spends it on the following: down payment or rent in a development put up by big business; education, in a school owned by big business; utilities owned by big business; clothing, gadgets, furniture, food, etc. sold in malls owned by big business; whatever is left, you either stick in a pension or some other plan sold to your family by big business, or deposited in the same bank owned by big business…

The point being, the person making the observation said, that the money you make primarily circulates within the subsidiaries of the established big businesses: whatever escapes from that system is, when you think of it, peanuts.

In other news, Basilan quiet but tense after deferred offensive but D-day in Basilan to push through Tuesday. In Newsbreak, a report asks, AFP: Learning from Mistakes?

Angat Dam reduces Metro water supply. Government’s embarked on cloud-seeding operations, but  Cloud-seeding fails to raise dam levels. there’s a lot of speculation, too, on government moves concerning power generation. This is because it’s big, big business. Everything related to the energy sector can be big, and controversial news. See Emergency deliveries of coal, fuel oil to keep plants running for example.

Tony Lopez discusses what’s involved in bidding for a power generation facility -and why power generation’s attractive to companies like San Miguel. See Asian Energy Advisors, maintained by Mamutong, for how foreign consultants view the energy sector’s opportunities, too. Now what I want to know is why we don’t have more of these: see Vista Pinas for a picture of Southeast Asia’s largest solar power plant, right here in the Philippines!

There are so many stories emerging -the controversy surrounding Meralco’s raising electric rates, arguments over whether there’s a real, or simulated, power shortage, what sort of deals are being made and who will profit from them- that it’s dizzying. Hopefully some bloggers familiar with the various issues will start posting and dissecting things.

Elsewhere on the economic front, Stock market bull run over — Deutsche Bank (not, the bank says, the government’s doing; bright spot today was GMA-7 stocks shine in trading debut, even as RP bourse falls). You may have noticed the Marcoses are aggressively pursuing ownership of shares and properties in the courts: US papers show Tan was Marcos’ partner.

Trying to expand his options, Villar says More choices for Blue Ribbon head. Playing for time, too:  Resolving Senate impasse may take 3 weeks, says Villar.

Overseas, Bangkok is “transfixed” by rumors concerning the Crown Prince’s health: see Rumor Nation. In Japan,  Abe Vows to Stay After Losing Japan’s Upper House (his party lost in the upper house; what’s interesting is how an upper house election is understood in Japan as in the nature of a referendum on the sitting administration). In Rorschach and Awe, Katherine Eban looks at how CIA psychologists reverse-engineered training they developed, to help US soldiers resist Communist-style interrogation techniques, and developed today’s “coercive interrogation methods”.

My column for today is Communal political vocabulary wanted.
Amando Doronila and Jarius Bondoc both tackle the ongoing reorganization of the Senate, and the problems it poses for Senate President Villar. Much will hinge, apparently, on who becomes Chairman of the powerful Blue Ribbon committee. The administration wants Joker Arroyo to keep it; some of Villar’s allies in the opposition are threatening to dump him if he gives in. In the House, Efren Danao tackles the so-called “independent” bloc formed by Rep. Garcia.
Quite a thought-provoking column by Conrado de Quiros today.

Also, Rasheed Abou-Alsamh on what TV shows tell us about a certain society.

In the blogosphere, my Inquirer Current entry is Calendar of values. John Nery, in his entry, asks, what was the best political insult?

Torn and Frayed points out the remarkable capacity of Filipinos to remember names and faces, and he tries to explain why this may be so.

Placeholder undertakes a thorough, and valuable, discussion on the automation of elections. He points to a report by Halal Marangal on the May 2007 elections, and its recommendations for a rational automation of elections.

Postcard Headlines gives a summary of the circumstances surrounding the abduction and continued disappearance of Jonas Burgos. See the news report, CA resumes hearing on Burgos disappearance.

blog@AWBHoldings.com also gives an enlightening summary of the circumstances that have led the Supreme Court to instruct the armed forces to produce Burgos (a deadline the military didn’t meet). In her blog, Notes of Marichu Lambino, she says what’s left is for those concerned to petition for a whole bunch of subpoenas:

General Bacarro and their other representatives are most likely already in transit to the Court of Appeals. They are expected to deny custody of Jonas Burgos.

Don’t let them get away with it. Subpoena, or move for the issuance of a subpoena ad testificandum and duces tecum for Army chief Lt. Gen. Romeo Tolentino and his intel report; he said that they did a background check on agriculturist Jonas Burgos and claimed he was a member of the New People’s Army “Front Committee 2 based in Bulacan”, and that he has the intel report to show for it (subpoena duces tecum for the intel report).

Parties to an action are entitled to the issuance of processes that would produce the evidence for their case; and if the Court of Appeals denies the Motion for issuance of subpoenas, then the Supreme Court should be able to order the Court of Appeals. This is an evidentiary hearing, or would today turn into an evidentiary hearing, because the Supreme Court had anticipated that the respondents would deny custody; and that was why they had ordered the parties to bring the person of Jonas Burgos to the Court of Appeals.

If those subpoenaed allege that matters of “national security” prevent them from testifying and from producing the documents, they can be given an executive session with the justices and the parties and no one else attending, and the records could be asked to be sealed if the Court thinks that these involve the sensitive matters (like names of agents, etc.). But if they refuse altogether to testify and to bring those reports, the petitioners could move to cite them in contempt.  And if in contempt, have them detained. Until they comply with the order to testify and produce the report. I know; if you push this to the legal limits, if the Court of Appeals and the Supreme Court use the extent of all the authority that they have, we might have an Armed Forces refusing to obey the writs of the Court. At some point, if the Supreme Court pushed this to the extent of all its authority, you’d have a stand-off. I know. But what else are we to do? Where else would the Burgoses run to?   

In his blog, Village Idiot Savant discusses the origin of the “trisikad” used in Davao.

And just for rather odd fun: the Hitler Safety Dance.

Technorati Tags: , , , , , , , ,

Tags:

Comments

117 Comments on "Communal political vocabulary wanted"

  1. benign0 on Mon, 30th Jul 2007 2:26 pm 

    I think the need for a communal lingo goes deeper than politics. If we hadn’t noticed yet, no real philosophical framework binds Pinoys outside of our “bahala na”, “pwede na yan” and “the lord will provide” mentalities.

    Politics can only be regarded properly and INTELLIGENTLY if a coherent thought/philosophical framework underlies it and serves as a robust context.

    That’s a tall order for a people famous for choosing leaders based on their ocho-ocho skills, who have a penchant for lapping up decades-old political taglines and slogans, whose main claim to fame in terms of contributing to world politics is the claimed invention of a soap-operatic extrajudicial form of street parlimentarianism, and who never fail to be hoodwinked into believing that a “united oppositions” exists every election time.

    How can we expect ourselves to develop a “communal political vocabulary” if we can’t even agree on what it means to be “Filipino”. We seem to be more familiar with what it means to be Ilocano, Cebuano, or Mangyan.

  2. indoro ni emilie on Mon, 30th Jul 2007 2:41 pm 

    amusing how benigno keeps on nitpicking the pinoy’s social proclivity to perfect their ocho-ocho skills while forgetting that it is this type of masa orientation which ushered in the POLITICAL phenomenon called PEOPLE POWER. do not underestimate the masa. benigs. they do know when to toe the political party lines and when to toe on and party.

  3. benign0 on Mon, 30th Jul 2007 3:03 pm 

    “it is this type of masa orientation which ushered in the POLITICAL phenomenon called PEOPLE POWER”

    Precisely my point. If you hadn’t noticed yet, People Power has been all but perverted by Pinoys having done it (or attempted to instigate it) once too many so much so that all we get now from the global community (not to mention the foreign media) is a big YAWN whenever yet another Fiesta Revolution is undertaken. ;)

    There’s only so much that herd mentality can bring upon. The real gains happen when THINKING is applied.

  4. indoro ni emilie on Mon, 30th Jul 2007 3:16 pm 

    i have no argument with perversion of people power. i was not impressed with edsa 2 myself. edsa 2, btw, was a middle class revolution sparked by ocho-ocho ringtones.

    why the need to define what is a filipino when you can just be? but if this really boggles you, the best authority to define who we are is someone who is not one of us.

  5. Jon Limjap on Mon, 30th Jul 2007 3:32 pm 

    Manolo,

    Are you trying to insinuate that big business is inherently evil, for having to charge money for basic goods and services? Should big businesses give these away for free?

  6. Bokyo on Mon, 30th Jul 2007 3:35 pm 

    When someone deserves it you do not have to say it. Respect will be given. If one does not deserve it people will be cold, even shame him/her. Even in competition even if you do not like the winner if he/she deserves it you have to congratulate him/her or join everybody in praising the victory not only him/her winning but to the success of the competition. We all have to work out not just to determine the winner but also to make sure that we work hard in the process that determines it.

  7. Bokyo on Mon, 30th Jul 2007 3:40 pm 

    What really sad is that, nobody among our “leaders” in the government, in congress, etc. makes the decision that the allegation is not true or this is very serious and needs to be deeply looked at.

  8. inodoro ni emilie on Mon, 30th Jul 2007 3:49 pm 

    benigs,

    i’ve been to the link you posted in the response thread to john. your posting is so typical of a pinoy loathing, especially among those who have uprooted themselves from the country. which in fact makes you very pinoy.

    russell’s paradox, dude. that’s where you find yourself in.

  9. mlq3 on Mon, 30th Jul 2007 4:23 pm 

    john limjap: no. personally, i view big business as morally neutral. it is accountable to shareholders. but i do think it’s worth pondering whether or not the beneficiary on the whole ends up big business. there should be plenty for everybody, if government referees matters properly, and the business environment is such that companies large and small all have a piece of the pie. if the whole pie goes to the big players only, that can’t be a good thing.

  10. Arbet on Mon, 30th Jul 2007 4:30 pm 

    Businesses earn big but pay pittance to their employees…

    Now that is sad.

  11. Bokyo on Mon, 30th Jul 2007 5:15 pm 

    Yes, always the rich get richer.

  12. marichu c. lambino on Mon, 30th Jul 2007 5:28 pm 

    Hi Manolo! A couple of days ago, in a “group column” in the Inquirer, Fe Zamora reported that whenever she asked her contacts in the military and the police for any information on the whereabouts of Jonas Burgos, they replied, everytime: “Ask Tintoy” , “Tintoy” being the nickname of Army chief Lt. General Romeo Tolentino. Wish we could write about better days. Regards! – marichu

  13. benign0 on Mon, 30th Jul 2007 5:39 pm 

    “your posting is so typical of a pinoy loathing, especially among those who have uprooted themselves from the country. which in fact makes you very pinoy”

    What can I say? I am indeed Pinoy. Never denied it. And even what you say is true, my point is: So what?

    Does that change the sad reality that those adjectives I cited ring undisputably true? ;)

  14. vic on Mon, 30th Jul 2007 7:22 pm 

    Re; Hitler Safety Dance…Was thinking all along that the Jive is one latest and most modern dance. the man did the perfect demo of social jive long before “dancing with the Stars”…

  15. RoelM on Mon, 30th Jul 2007 7:35 pm 

    Hi MLQ3,

    Respecting the office of the president while disliking/hating the person occupying it would be very difficult in practice. It would be even more so if the issue is legitimacy which goes much deeper than mere policy disagreement or personal dislike.

    The Thais can afford to have laws against disrespecting the king precisely because over there there is separation of roles between head of state and head of gov’t. It is precisely because the king is a non-partisan head of state that respect can be given to him without much reservation. The Thais can still respect the king while disliking the gov’t. Our political system precludes this desirable scenario precisely because it merges the roles of head of state and head of gov’t. Dislike/hate of the occupant of the presidential office translates into disrepute of the office which in turn translates into the disrepute of the state. Disrepute of the state affects the country and nation of which the state is the political expression.

  16. cvj on Mon, 30th Jul 2007 7:46 pm 

    Manolo, thanks for the link! I’m hoping that the IT and Telecommunications Companies don’t see election automation as just another business opportunity. I’m hoping they put their best minds together towards nation building.

  17. john marzan on Mon, 30th Jul 2007 8:23 pm 

    talo RP. 84-76.

  18. supremo on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 12:43 am 

    mlq3 asked “Now what I want to know is why we don’t have more of these”

    On average 1000 watts per square meter falls as sunlight power. The most efficient photovoltaic cells has 10% efficiency which means it can only capture 10% of the sunlight power that falls into it.

    The Philippines has an average 7 kw/m2/day of solar radiation. 10% is 700 watts.

    Land area of the Philippines 300,000 km2 = 30,000,000 hectares = 3,000,000,000,000 m2

    How much of it is level land? No more than 1% slope. Lets just say 10%.

    3,000,000,000,000 m2 X 10% = 300,000,000,000 m2

    How much has sunlight the whole year? Let’s just say 10%

    300,000,000,000 m2 X 10% = 30,000,000,000 m2

    Potential electricity from solar power.

    30,000,000,000 m2 X 700 watts = 210,000,000,000 watts = 210,000,000 kw = 210,000 Mw

    3000 km2 of the land area generating 210,000 Mw of electricity for 12 hours. That land area is a little bit bigger than Davao City.

    Now we have to choose between planting rice and generating electricity.

  19. Eugene on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 1:02 am 

    Hey, Manolo, thanks for the link to Vista Pinas! I’m glad you found that solar power plant as enlightening as I did. :)

  20. supremo on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 1:24 am 

    How not to have brownouts:
    1)Install NaS batteries everywhere. A 1.2 megawatt 30-foot-wide by 15-foot-high NaS battery can cost as much as $2.5 M. Meralco can charge the batteries at night when electric rates are lower and use them during the day.
    2)Run all power plants as base power plants. Base power plants run all the time. Peak power plants run only during peak demands. An example is Calaca 1 and 2. Calaca 1 runs as a base power plant and Calaca 2 runs only during peak hours. Same thing for Manila 1 and 2 before being mothballed.

  21. Devilsadvc8 on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 3:49 am 

    i wish technology could develop wherein we could harness the power of storms for electricity

    then we could sell our excess electricity to other storm-starved countries, wahehe.

    or a device that could turn a politician’s hot-air into electricity. that would solve all our power problems. not to mention that these same guys would finally have some use.

    btw, MLQ3 waxes melancholic abt a generation gone past where politics and their vocabulary still had meaning.
    i guess he’s feeling the crunch of aging and meeting young and younger folks. tehee.

  22. Karlo Mikhail on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 6:49 am 

    Hello there. :)

    Thanks for mentioning my blog post about Jonas.

    About the need or a political language, I think the problem is deeply rooted in the country’s educational system. As was pointed out in the column, its “not economic status, and not educational attainment (the audiences I address are either in, or have finished, college).” It’s the type of education itself that is the problem.

    And this is confounded by a whole bunch of other factors resulting to the creation of today’s generation of young people that generally shuns political discourse. I haven’t really look into this fully (and do not have the capability yet to do so), but I would like to believe that it is the further degeneration of the country’s economic structure that is causing this shift.

    Like, we wouldn’t be needing all those concepts about check and balances and the likes if all we’d be doing is going abroad, working as call center agents in business process outsourcing (BPO) centers or as semi-skilled laborers in special ecozones, or digging up nickel in mines opened up for foreigners, etc.

    I have nothing against all that I’ve just mentioned. I’m even a supporter of the development of the country’s BPO potentionals. But I just think there should be more options. And yes, this was actually one of our many problems back then when I was still active in organizing as a student activist. This lack of a “common political vocabulary” made it harder to mobilize for a cause.

    God Bless! :)

  23. Karlo Mikhail on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 7:01 am 

    Hmmm, the third sentence in my last comment should begin with “About the need FOR A COMMON political language” and not “About the need or a political language.” That’s all.

  24. benign0 on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 7:44 am 

    “why the need to define what is a filipino when you can just be? but if this really boggles you, the best authority to define who we are is someone who is not one of us”

    Amusing how some people are so presumptious as to unilaterally determine who has or who has no right to be considered to be “Filipino” (whatever THAT means). ;)

    And if you see no merit in any effort to define what is a “Filipino”, that’s your prerogative. But if this view reflects the majority view, then it explains a lot about why our society is the way it is.

  25. inodoro ni emilie on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 8:01 am 

    benigs,

    in no way did i imply who has or hasn’t the right to determine who the pinoy is. i just suggested the best authority is someone who is not one of us. simple math logic dude: A cannot distinguish itself unless there is a contraposition non-A.

    you ask what’s wrong with being pinoy? gee whiz, i thought you were the one making all these fuss about being pinoy. not me. your description of pinoy being non-productive, non-imaginative, etc., can all apply to all cultures. but why rub these in? only to suit your contrived perception?

    you live in australia where being australian has to be defined because there are no marked uniqueness in their cultural traits–it being a multicultural, multi-racial setting. the overaching social and political framework thus becomes an imperative, otherwise you will see a clash of cultures, religious and political beliefs. ditto for u.s.a. if the majority of pinoys do not spend time defining who they are, it is perhaps because they feel no need for it because they already ARE. esse, dude, esse. cogito ergo sum.

  26. inodoro ni emilie on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 8:04 am 

    that should read overarching, not overaching. which in a way you may be doing.

  27. vic on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 8:05 am 

    Now Ms Arroyo has a Partner in Japan PM Abe, both are lame ducks. Although Abe still control the Lower House, which the Leader of the Ruling Party is chosen as PM, Japanese leaders usually take responsibility for their party lose and Resign, but they are learning the Art of the likes of Justice Sec. Gonzales, who blunders every which way, but still sticking like Crazy Glue. Maybe Abe got a call from President Arroyo after the polls?

  28. neonate on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 8:57 am 

    Inodoro, Speaking of energy consumption, When a person is down, is it proper to kick him so he stays down or would helping him get up be more productive. Both acts consume about the same amount of energy.
    Supreme, do your numbers allow for nimbus clouds that do not produce rain?

  29. Jon Limjap on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 9:05 am 

    mlq3,

    Well that’s why there’s the saying “if you can’t beat them, join them”. Of course that takes you to two possible paths: join their company, or put up a business yourself, hopefully one that will not compete with big business or one that the big businesses will not offer, or one that is peripheral but vital to big business.

    My wife and I are trying that “peripheral” path (we have a small home-based travel agency business) and it’s quite hard, but it’s also quite fulfilling. But my point is there are ways so that small players could get a piece of that pie too. Unfortunately it’s exactly up to them to figure out the *how*.

  30. inodoro ni emilie on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 9:07 am 

    neonate,

    you throwing the question to me or to benigs?

  31. neonate on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 9:12 am 

    Inodoro, you first.

  32. Jon Limjap on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 9:13 am 

    inodoro,

    Leave benign0 be.

    Detailing how bad and hopeless Pinoys are is his job. The fact that he’s good at it reveals that he is, in fact, very Pinoy, among other things.

    benign0,

    Keep up the good work. ;)

  33. inodoro ni emilie on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 9:28 am 

    neonate,

    productivity = output/input. the assumption is that both activity [kicking and picking] consume the same amount of energy. by holding this constant, so one is looking at output orientation. my answer: whichever does not trammel the filipino spirit. [*inodoro dances to ocho-ocho, segueing to pinoy-ako*]

  34. neonate on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 9:31 am 

    benignO, your turn.

  35. rego on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 10:14 am 

    looks like we will be having same and same problem if Manny Villar become president. the cycle of compromises and utang na loob continues. Why can he just decide by himself on who should chair the blue ribbon. Heck, if I were him, I ‘ll put Allan Peter in that job. After all he is the only other NP in that all. And Allan Peter has shown so much interest in Getting the heads of teh Arroyos while he was a congressman.

    And yet he is so vocal about Glorias being a lameduck.

    And I saw Chiz on tv saying to point of threatening that the Blue ribbon chair go to opposistion only. Geeeeez if only he and the other 3 or four other “mongrels” according to Lacson just stick with teh opposistion. eh wala sanang problema. Lahat ng chairman ng committe eh sa opposistion sana. sus ginoo!

    Just can’t help but agree with benigno most of the time….

  36. The Ca t on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 10:23 am 

    Austero’s column about Neri shows that he does not understand the organizational structure of the Department of Education which was formerly DECS the Department of Education, Culture and Sports.

    DECS was divided into three agencies, the Deped which takes care of all that concerns elementary and high school. CHED (Commission of Higher Education) is responsible for College, Graduate and Post-grads while the TESDA is responsible for vocational and skill training.

    As CHED chairman which has only one year office except when extended for holdover just like Dr. Carlito Puno, it is not enough to overhaul the curricullar offerings of the
    thousands of private universities of the country. State universities have their own charter so they are not under CHED.

    Chairmanship is from what I understand is rotated to the five chairmen who have five years’ tenure.

  37. benign0 on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 10:24 am 

    “When a person is down, is it proper to kick him so he stays down or would helping him get up be more productive. Both acts consume about the same amount of energy”

    neonate, to take my turn I have to ask this first: can the treatment of a person be equated to the treatment of a society?

    By wording your question the way you did, it implies that metaphorically kicking a PERSON when he is down is the ethical equivalent of metaphorically kicking a SOCIETY when it is down.

    I get these questions a bit too often.

    Another comes in this form:

    “Shouldn’t you love your country undconditionally the way you love your mother?”

    It takes a bit of thinking beyond the romanticism Pinoy minds are wired to embrace to see beyond the hypocrisy of statements/challenges like these.

    Surely one’s regard for their country cannot be compared to one’s regard for his/her mother. By the same token, people will tend to have less inclination to kick a PERSON while he is on the ground than, say, dissing an entire society.

    So if we limit the discussion to dissing an entire society which, as Limjap pointed out, I see as my mission in cyberlife, my answer is a resounding YES.

    My job is EASY because the very nature of Pinoy society makes it so. And that’s the sad reality.

  38. inodoro ni emilie on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 10:57 am 

    “It takes a bit of thinking beyond the romanticism Pinoy minds are wired to embrace to see beyond the hypocrisy of statements/challenges like these.”

    wired to embrace? is that a psychobiological scientific fact applicable only to pinoys? you make it sound conclusive, if not exclusive. anything to suit your perception.

  39. cvj on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 12:53 pm 

    i agree with inodoro’s math. we filipinos, just are. i’ve seen enough of the world to know that this is the case. Moreover, anyone who has a passing familiarity with statistical facts about our country as well as an appreciation of the laws of probability, would realize that exceptionalism (on both sides) is a sign of immaturity and narcissism. In that sense, both benign0’s pinoy bashing and good news pilipinas rose tinted projections are manifestations of the same juvenile trait. we need to navigate between the extremes of cockiness and despair so that we don’t oversell ourselves, or sell ourselves short.

  40. neonate on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 1:16 pm 

    Mlq3, Inodoro, BenignO, thank you all for the insights on Physics, Energy and Philosophy in your blog.The match was exciting.

  41. benign0 on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 1:46 pm 

    “i agree with inodoro’s math. we filipinos, just are.”

    As a matter of fact, the above kind of thinking was Square One in the 3000-year journey Western thinking took to reach the astounding level of achievement it enjoys today (from which, might I remind everyone, our hollow-headedly cherished “democracy” was derived).

    The Greek philosophers, and then other great thinkers in the last couple of millenia built upon this primitive axiom to develop what today is an entire thought framework that underpins the achievement of Western civilisation.

    So to be content with such a simpleton’s philosophy as “we simply ARE” (and not even be the least bit curious of what this “are” means) would be the equivalent of imprisoning ourselves wihtin the frame of mind of the average 1000 B.C. schmoe. ;)

  42. cvj on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 2:14 pm 

    Benign0, knowing that we just ‘are’ does not mean lack of self-awareness. It means taking the bad along with the good and getting on with the business of making life better in the spirit of quiet self-confidence. Taking on a consistently pessimistic or optimistic stance contradicts reality and therefore is illogical. As far as Western Philosophy is concerned, try catching up on your C.S. Pierce (‘firstness’, ’secondness’, ‘thirdness’,), Heidegger (‘throwness’) and Wittgenstein (‘form of life’) to supplement your Socrates (‘Know thyself’) and Descartes (‘I think therefore, i am).

  43. manuelbuencamino on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 2:15 pm 

    Supremo,

    your argument against solar power farms can be applied to the Zubiri/Arroyo biofuels scam. The end result is the same

    “we have to choose between planting rice and generating electricity.”

  44. manuelbuencamino on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 2:21 pm 

    MLQ,

    Re: your column – “I’d add, respect for the position, regardless of how one feels about the holder of that position–including whether one believes that position is held legitimately or illegitimately. After all, until someone else occupies it, there’s only one person serving as president.”

    Since Gloria is illegitimate, I think the last three words in the paragraph can to changed to “occupying the presidency”

  45. pinoy on Tue, 31st Jul 2007 11:35 pm 

    Big business is doing good simply because we love to spend. Shoemart, Jollibee, Globe, PLDT/Smart, San Miguel, Ayala, JG Summit are growing because of our insatiable appetite to consume. ABS CBN and GMA Network are doing very well because advertisers are competing for our attention. Being the voracios consumers that we are made us the billboard and texting capital of the world.

    So it isn’t exactly the fault of big business if most of the wealth concentrated in their bank accounts. They saw an opportunity and took advantage of it. They know we love to consume so they are very willing to take the risk of making investments and opening up more branches.

    If we don’t spend our money as much as we do, will Jollibee and Shoemart become what they are now? We must learn to save and spend wisely. Big business are doing very well because of what we are as a people. Let us change our spending behavior and chances are business will complain.

  46. Devilsadvc8 on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 3:09 am 

    “We must learn to save and spend wisely.”

    Sadly, even the motivations of saving (in the traditional way, like putting your money in a bank), isn’t as good as it sounds. the paltry rate at which your money grows in interest scares the hell out of me, and tells me im better off spending my money now than sticking it in a bank jz to watch its value get overtaken by inflation. no siree.

    and investing in health and life insurances aren’t as sound either, as these guys will jz find ways to screw you over. control of the industry sucks, and even gov’t run social security won’t make you feel safe. your money’s only as safe as the next honest politician is. either way, both of you are fucked.

    no wonder a lot of Pinoys look outward for salvation. things jz doesn’t look good. not to me anyway. but a quiet afternoon with Madam might cheer some of you folks. if there is one good quality she have, it is this: she’s a very optimistic person.

    so the glass isn’t half-empty for her. it isn’t even half-full. her optimism is such that she thinks the glass is full. “over-flowingly” full.

    heck, she must try one of these days to be in the shoes of us regular Pinoys and I doubt she’d see it that way.

  47. BrianB on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 3:31 pm 

    Bengin0
    “Politics can only be regarded properly and INTELLIGENTLY if a coherent thought/philosophical framework underlies it and serves as a robust context.”

    Sorry I hadn’t read this post earlier.

    Benign0, look in the mirror. Your language is the language of big business: “robust,” “underlies,” “coherent thought.”

    About the OFW vs Big Business. I’ve been saying this a long time but no one will listen. It’s the haciendero mentality. The working classes break their back or their hearts or their spirits while the rich get richer.

    It’s the stupidest thing in the world. The rich can be segregated into a very small minority sector. They should be the api. But Filipinos by their tens of billions are letting these fat asses get away with all the rent-seeking, land-grabbing business mentality of their forefathers.

  48. BrianB on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 3:37 pm 

    I’ll say this again. Tax these people. If they wanna leave, then write a law that declares them as traitors so they can never come back. Confiscate all land taken by the Spanish from natives. If you happen to have bough land from the Spanish, then sorry ka nalang. Pag nakaw na motorsiklo binili mo, nakaw pa rin yun.

    The problem of this nation is racism. We never had a proper transition period since the Spanish left. Culturally, we’re still a conquered people. Hell, they don’t even teach democracy in our school system, and the morals and individualistic pride that is inherent in democratic thinking.What do they teach? Discipline and respect for authority. Our government practice social engineering. I went to public schools and we had to scrub floors and plant okra. For crying out loud? Thinking back, this country never sounded like a democracy. And how can we be a democracy ruled by the people when the inheritors of the Kastilas still rule over us?

  49. BrianB on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 3:43 pm 

    pinoy,

    Big Business is lazy. They never risk their money for progress. They don’t innovate. The business that makes money are basic necessities: clothing, food, heck even cell phone load.

    Why can’t you people accept the obvious. Walang venture capital na galing sa mga conglomerates. Walang financial support mga imbentor natin at walang innovation dito sa pilipinas – not because we lack innovators (we’re almost 90 million, for God’s sake) but because big business don’t think that risk is part of business. Our conglomerates don’t even operate like real businesses. Look how government bailed out the Lopezes several times.

    Sayang ang panahon at ang talento. I’ve been part of the work force for many years, and I am convinced big businesses do not need talented people. Walang talent sa San Miguel, Ayala Group, Lopez Group, Gokongwei Group at kung anong anong group. Kalilangan ba nila magaling na engineer, na scientist, kailangan nila innovator.

    You bet on an innovation, you get rewarded exponentially. Everyone in the world knows that except the Filipino rich. Ang alam lang nila baka malugi sila.

  50. BrianB on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 3:43 pm 

    Yan awaiting moderation uli.

  51. BrianB on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 3:59 pm 

    sorry that’s Filipinos in their tens of millions.

  52. Pedro on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 4:17 pm 

    I have a better idea Brian. Why don’t we just ban the citizens from being able to leave the country. We can do the same as North Korea. I’m tired of blaming the current and past administrations and even the Americans for our problems. I guess it’s time we blame the Spaniards. I’m all for that idea in getting back land taken by the Spaniards. I just hope my pre-spanish era ancestors were in the ruling class during time.

  53. BrianB on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 4:31 pm 

    Listen Pedro, not the point at all. The bad habits we have now of looking down on the brown-skinned citizenry, of coddling land-grabbers in their insidious mediocrity and tolerating thieving politicos (recent and past adiministrations alike) for sheer force of habit can be traced back to the Spanish era, which bad habits we could’ve done something about by recognizing the criminalities of the Spaniards. So, damay nga mga inheritors nila, pati na yung mga mayayaman na yumaman sa kapanhunan nang mga kastila.

    Look at what’s happening now, even the military are acting like pit bulls for the hacienderos. Sino bang pumapatay sa maga lumalabang trabahador sa hacienda?

  54. The Ca t on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 4:39 pm 

    About the OFW vs Big Business. I’ve been saying this a long time but no one will listen. It’s the haciendero mentality. The working classes break their back or their hearts or their spirits while the rich get richer.

    What have you been reading boy, paperback?

    That rich getting richer is a global phenomenon and not only in the Philippines syndrome like what you are suffering right now.

    OFW hacienda mentality. Pakisampal ako. I do not want a rocket scientist just to understand your mumblings.

    Nasa work force ka pa lang and you seem to talk with authority about business? Eh paano kaya kung nakapagtayo ka na ng negosyo? baka magsulat ka na rin ng libro and come up with an economic principle?

    Why not blame the datu who ceded an island for a golden salakot. Sige hukayin mo at pagsampal-sampalin mo.

    In the world, there is such a thing as proactive. And I think you are lacking of it.

  55. BrianB on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 4:40 pm 

    And you’re right, our culture before wasn’t democratic either. We had slaves and such. But even slaves in that era were able to eat. It was the responsibility of the chieftains to take care of everyone. Compare that to today. Marami pa ring chieftains (I was mistaken not to include pre-Spanish culture in my tirade, which is obviously still influential even today) but they shirk from their old responsibilities by hiding behind the democratic process. Better to have a monarchy where the real responsibilities of the monrach is recognized than have a democracy which is only facade with people behind this facade living like kings and queens.

    The point is this, maybe the reason why our people does not do something about the country’s ill is because they are still, culturally, pre-democratic. And don’t tell me we Filipinos need to evolve first before we become a true democracy. One generation is enough if the educational system cooperates. Wala nagang democracia sa eskwelahan eh. What is the reason for this? I point to the riuling class. They’re not stupid. They know if Filipinos were truly democratic they will losee everything: their land, their power, everything. They’ll live amongst the people as equals of the people. Mga anak nang kayumangi and yayaman. Anak nila magtutulak nang kariton nang basura.

  56. BrianB on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 4:47 pm 

    CAT,

    Globally, the heirs of the rich are poorer now. Cyclical ang mudo. Parang gulong. Eh dito sa Pinas, ano? Tanong mo sarili mo bakit sa Malaysia gumagawa sila nang kotse at cellphone. Satin tayo mahilig sa kotse at cell phone pero hindi tay nagmamanufacture.

    And listen to yourself. You don’t even know me. You assume I am less educated than the other commenters here? CAT, it’s one of those bad habits I’ve been talking about. It’s self-flagellation projected upon others.

    Proactive-proactive ka dyan, ibang tao ang galing magnakaw at pumatay nang tao, ikaw proactive lang?

  57. BrianB on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 4:56 pm 

    CAT,

    Don’t discriminate against people younger than you and don’t assume people my age know less than older folks. The hoistory of this country is littered with the blood of younger people. Our heroes were all in my age bracket when they made the ultimate sacrifice for their country. Hindi lang tayo racist dito sa pilipinas, we also discriminate against the youth. History po nang pilipinas, mga youth ang may pinakamalaking contribution. Mga matatanda yun yung mga kurakot.

  58. BrianB on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 5:03 pm 

    “Why not blame the datu who ceded an island for a golden salakot. Sige hukayin mo at pagsampal-sampalin mo.”

    She doesn’t even know her history. It’s the datus who bought the Panay plains for a golden salakot. Ang Ita pumunta sa bundok. Lugi pa nga mga Malay eh, dahil and kapatagan binabaha tuwing tag ulan. Golden salakot tapos ilang kaban nang mga alahas. Yun.

  59. The Ca t on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 5:41 pm 

    I am guilty of that history blunder coz it’s been history.

    Bakit mas marami ka bang alam? Your posts show that you are still clueless to almost everything.

    So naive and so idealistic. Magtravel ka muna at magbabago ang perspective mo sa buhay.

    History was written by the colonizers and the victors.

    Age may not bring wisdom but age gives more experience and exposure.

    Kung baga sa poultry, sisiw ka pa lang. Dont be too cocky.

  60. taipan88 on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 6:08 pm 

    [quote]Now Ms Arroyo has a Partner in Japan PM Abe, both are lame ducks. [/quote]

    PM Abe is by far, a better person than gloria; And I don’t think he’d ask gloria for help….

    Besides, Mr. Abe did not steal a position, nor did he steal an election.
    At least in Japan, people who blunder openly ask for apologies and bow out of public eye. Not so in Inang Bayan!

    Perhaps, PM Abe’s choice of people were not so good, hence the mishaps and the blunder. But at least, citizens can see where their taxes go. Can we say the same in Inang Bayan?

  61. benign0 on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 7:36 pm 

    Let’s not be too beholden to “elders”. If their so-called “values” were really as great as they say they were, then how come the Philippines turned into the basketcase that it is today under their watch?

  62. cvj on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 8:07 pm 

    Benign0, you’re really getting efficient in packing together attribution errors. Anyway, respect for elders (like love for country) is not a transactional matter.

  63. BrianB on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 9:28 pm 

    Cat, I studied in the U.S. Wag mung i assume na dahil marunong ako magtagalog eh jolog ako. Nag paptraktis lang. Ilonggo ako eh.

  64. BrianB on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 9:33 pm 

    CVJ,

    They make it as if it’s in the constitution.

  65. BrianB on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 10:06 pm 

    As far as I’m concerned, old people have nothing to offer. The worst thing is, if you have guests who are foreigners or just cousins from abroad they give those “kids” a lot more respect than they give you. Nakakalalaki. They don’t just look down on you, they stab you in the back as well, spouting out principles that they don’t believe themselves. Yes, my experience is older people use morality to hold younger people forever in their debt. They are not very moral themselves and are often obviously and openly hypocritical. They don’t respect younger people. I’m sorry CAT, but I take offense in your language. Manolo, isn’t CAT’s posts a personal attack to me? Then why isn’t she being moderated? Is it because she is OLDER? There is a serious flaw in ethical standards in this country. Even people like MLQ3 miss a beat now and then.

  66. Pedro on Wed, 1st Aug 2007 11:19 pm 

    Brian, Its good to know that you studied in the US. So what exactly have you learned? I’m sure you noticed the big difference when you got your drivers license from the DMV compared to getting one from the LTO right? Of course you also noticed the big difference in banking, business application permits, professional licensing, work ethics and how government contracts get awarded right? You already know that governments in developed countries strive to create an environment that will entice more business investments, growth in industry, competition and this of course leads to the need for human resources., Governments of course invest in education to support this need blah blah blah… So because your armed with a US college degree and you have all this knowledge and experience, you’re saying that we should do away with big business? What, you think we should form a benevolent government to take over the business groups you mentioned. You think we can force business to make investments? Seems like you’re pissed of at rich people. Weren’t there any rich people when you were in the US acquiring your expertise? And please tell me what exactly is this grand scheme being done by the big bad old people to put down the youth?

  67. mlq3 on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 12:13 am 

    brianb, maybe i wasn’t clear. by personal attack i mean death threats. someone did that once, regarding a private person and i banned them. otherwise, we’re all old enough to defend ourselves here.

    on another point: whether a person upholds principles or not doesn’t invalidate those principles, in terms of their value for others or their applicability to all generations.

  68. BrianB on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 1:04 am 

    Not big business. Please, I shouldn;t have to repeat my points, do I. It’s big business here in the Philippines. Businesses that come from hacienda money or logging money. Our type of big business that did not grow because they were better than other businesses but thrived through rent-seeking and outright thievery. And most importantly, big business inherited from the kastilas. These real estate moguls, if they paid for their land at all, paid the wrong people. They paid the thieves. These broadcasting and utilities families, they got rich through rent-seeking. Rent-seeking happens even today.

    Here’s how wikipedia describes it:

    “Rent seeking generally implies the extraction of uncompensated value from others without making any contribution to productivity… ”

    Sound familiar to you?

    Didn’t get a degree abroad. Just spent a few years of middle school there. College too expensive. What did I learn, nothing better than what I know from books or watching TV. Depends on the state. Was in NYC.

  69. Pedro on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 1:13 am 

    …And brian, I’m probably stretching here but you may have been living independently for a couple of years now and realized how ugly the real world is. You’re pissed that what’s going on is not in line with what you learned in school. Some people make it, some people don’t, and some were just born lucky. It’s not that bad. Rich dad Poor Dad by Robert Kiyosaki might be an interesting read for you.

  70. BrianB on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 1:29 am 

    He, I’m starting my own business and currently employ over a dozen people part time (this is regular part time, not on a casual or per-project basis, and I pay my taxes, mind you). But thanks for your concern. I’m not anywhere close to being rich, though, if that’s what you mean.

    My anger doesn’t all come from personal experience but from reading newsies and watching TV. All those disappeared, people arrested without warrants of arrest and not heard of since. What I really can’t stand is the “Cojuangco” land in Tarlac. Unbelievable to me. I had lawyer friends explain it all to me. Just plain unbelievable.

    Please let’s stay within the more manageable sphere of general ideas and current events. My personal life is too complex for this forum :)

  71. BrianB on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 1:32 am 

    MLQ3: “on another point: whether a person upholds principles or not doesn’t invalidate those principles, in terms of their value for others or their applicability to all generations.”

    Hm. I want it to apply but the unprincipled use it against you and your left with your defenses down. Know what I mean. It’s like you’re the sheep and they are the wolves. No contest. Hypocrites rule when everybody else refuse to judge the hypocrites.

  72. The Ca t on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 7:21 am 

    Brianb,
    Here is a hankie, wipe your nose and your tear. I did not call you names.

    Your posts reveal your personality. So much angst for nothing.

    Just look at these statements of yours:

    As far as I’m concerned, old people have nothing to offer. The worst thing is, if you have guests who are foreigners or just cousins from abroad they give those “kids” a lot more respect than they give you. Nakakalalaki.

    Just because your old folks behave that way, old folks are all the same. Ever heard of fallacy? Daming matatamaang commenter niyan dito na matatanda. hehehe
    Magpahinog ka muna siguro, bago ka sumabak dito sa forum na ito, hane. O kaya observe and learn.

    So if you studied abroad what? Keber ko. Ako matagal na dito sa States, matatas pang magtagalog.

    What’s wrong with being jologs?

  73. benign0 on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 7:36 am 

    Ayan na. Labasan na at grandstanding na ng mga personal achievements. Magaling talaga tayo sa personalan.

    Tsk tsk. Pinoy nga naman talaga. Scorpions sting because that’s all they know how to do. Pinoys make personal attacks because that’s about the only thing in their intellectual arsenal to call on.

    Hey Cat, ingat ka lang, you might get into another one of your tililing rampages.

    Sorry, that’s just me being Pinoy. ;)

  74. inodoro ni emilie on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 7:55 am 

    “Ayan na. Labasan na at grandstanding na ng mga personal achievements. Magaling talaga tayo sa personalan.”

  75. inodoro ni emilie on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 7:59 am 

    haha. nuon ko pa nabanggit ito, benigs. yong mga hambog dito, do your ego-inflating activities in your self-involving, self-glorying blogs, and relish the adulation of your self-created sitemeter fans.

  76. BrianB on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 10:52 am 

    “Magpahinog ka muna siguro, bago ka sumabak dito sa forum na ito, hane. O kaya observe and learn.”

    Mga hinog na alam ko 15 to 25 years old. Lampas na nun, prune na tawag dun.

  77. BrianB on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 11:25 am 

    “Ayan na. Labasan na at grandstanding na ng mga personal achievements. Magaling talaga tayo sa personalan.”

    This behavior is not limited to Filipinos. If yuo’ve been to forums made up of people in the U.S. and Europe, VCs get leaked all the time. That’s what’s wrong with the semi-anonymity of this forum. Some people just don’t know how to behave in Web 2.0 arena. Like CAT for example. CAT, the usual snobberies in the real world don’t work. I can wear you out as I’m online 15 hours a day. JUst didn’t figure out too soon that the attack on my young personality had nothing to do with what we’ve been discussing here. Personal nga. You’re pissed off CAT that as a new poster here on Quezon.ph, I had the guts to post very opinionated comments?

    You have to realize that there’s nothing that pisses me off more than people lacking Web 2.0 sophistication, people with who take their old presumptions to a forum built to chip away on those old presumptions. Ganun talaga buhay dito sa Web, maski di ka kilalang tao, may K ka.

    That’s why people like MLQ3 take the time to create sites like this. If he spends all his time on talk shows and writing for newspapers, he may lose sight of what’s really out there. I know this more than you’ll ever know, CAT. Here’s a smiley face bonus :)

  78. cvj on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 11:49 am 

    Mga hinog na alam ko 15 to 25 years old. Lampas na nun, prune na tawag dun. – BrianB

    I thought the same 15 to 25 years ago. Soon enough, many will have the opportunity to be at the receiving end.

  79. BrianB on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 12:06 pm 

    CVJ,

    It’ll probably help if I give them due respect.

  80. Devilsadvc8 on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 12:24 pm 

    I get the sense Brian has a lot of pent-up anger, misdirected no doubt. He rises up, at the slightest hint of an insult, or an opposition to his views.

    Just a bit of advice Brian, an opposition to one’s views/opinions doesn’t mean a personal attack agst one’s person immediately. as everyone said, do not take it so personal. i for one, have crossed swords with one of the regulars here, one time or another. it didn’t mean he is my personal enemy just bec we differed in our views. christ, we were both anti-GMA for pete’s sakes! i jz didn’t agree to what he was saying, thus I spoke up. and likewise, i didn’t take offense when he challenged my argument. unless you haven’t noticed, this blog was opened up for this exact purpose. to allow people to air their views and disagree w/the author and w/each other.

    and I believe this is what CAT did. having lurked in this blog a much longer time than you, i can reasonably say i know CAT a lil bit.

    she’s fond of being sarcastic, i noticed. hence her words may really sting. but as far as i know, she never personally attacks anyone bec of their stature. she doesn’t “speak up” here often. perhaps it’s bec she only posts when she reads something she disagrees with.

    so settle down. no need to call for moderation by Manolo. para kang batang pikon. tatakbo ke Mommy at magsusumbong.

  81. BrianB on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 12:44 pm 

    “In the world, there is such a thing as proactive. And I think you are lacking of it.”

    “Kung baga sa poultry, sisiw ka pa lang. Dont be too cocky.”

    “Here is a hankie, wipe your nose and your tear. I did not call you names.”

    “Magpahinog ka muna siguro, bago ka sumabak dito sa forum na ito, hane. O kaya observe and learn.”

    What do you call the above, constructive criticism?

    Pent-up anger? After a couple of days posting here, you still think it’s “pent-up” anger? If CAT were merely being sarcastic, I wonder if you can point out to me these sarcastic passages. What I can’t understand and abide is why these older people don’t want the younger generation to be better than they are. Can you please explain the logic to me. Why don’t… you… want… us… to be… better… then your generation? We used to be the most progressive nation in the ASEAN. Your generation caused this nation to be weak and all you people are good at is saying you know a lot and we don’t. Then why not share waht you know, instead of just holding the younger generation hostage to some esoteric knowledge you don’t even have the decency to share with your successors.

  82. cvj on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 12:48 pm 

    BrianB, if the future 15 to 25 year olds used your standards, i don’t think it will be enough for you alone to give due respect to your younger counterparts. What will happen is that these young adults will perceive each and every slight by their elders as the fault of the entire generation to which you belong to just as you ascribe the sins of Ca T (and whoever else) to an entire generation of Filipino elders.

  83. BrianB on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 12:59 pm 

    “so settle down. no need to call for moderation by Manolo. para kang batang pikon. tatakbo ke Mommy at magsusumbong.”

    You’re deluded. We’re my mommy here? If you mean my complaint to Manolo? Some of my comments were moderated. As Manolo explained it earlier, personal attacks are banned. I took it to mean, direct personal insults. Some of my posts had that and they were moderated while CAT’s wasn’t. And don’t give me advice about the personalities in this forum. I didn’t want this to be personal and if you read my posts, none of them directly insult people in this forum.

    This isn’t MySpace. If you want a social network, go to friendster.

    My impression of older people is that they lack a sense of responsibility for what their generation has done to this country. Politicians are not exceptions. Even ordinary people lack a sense of accountability, especially when they’re dealing with the youth.

    This is what I believe: People born in the 60s and older should apologize to the younger generation for the ills our generation will suffer. Problema nyo, rirespituhin nyo lang mga bata kung mamundok na at handa nang pumatay at mamatay.

  84. inodoro ni emilie on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 1:20 pm 

    “This is what I believe: People born in the 60s and older should apologize to the younger generation for the ills our generation will suffer. Problema nyo, rirespituhin nyo lang mga bata kung mamundok na at handa nang pumatay at mamatay.”

    may point ka, brian. kaya nga we shouldn’t be talking here of temporalities such as the current, whimsical state of stock market boom (which went kaboom two days ago), that the economy is doing well under she-who-shall-not-be-named, etc, etc. but rather this, HAVE we strengthened our democratic ideals so that future generations can reap on these rewards?

    rage, rage, brian, against the dying of the light. [wag ka lang munang mamundok.]

  85. cvj on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 1:21 pm 

    Problema nyo, rirespituhin nyo lang mga bata kung mamundok na at handa nang pumatay at mamatay. – BrianB

    Who is ‘nyo’? Aren’t you overgeneralizing or is it just for rhetorical effect?

  86. mlq3 on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 1:25 pm 

    brian points to something i’ve mulled over in past entries and in some pieces i’ve written.

    our leadership has tended to be young, going back to the generation of the revolution. problems arise and get compounded when a generation stays on past its prime and stifles innovation. nick joaquin identified this as an emerging problem, pre-war, and the logjam was only solved, temporarily, with magsaysay’s election in 1953.

    the second logjam began to make itself felt in the 1960s, when marcos’s generation, held back from its rise to power until the 50s, showed no signs of letting go.

    i wrote about this somewhere when i pointed out how many elections could have taken place, had the martial law era not taken place: 1973, 1977, 1981, 1985. four administrations, with four opportunities for a new vision, could have taken place in that time.

    as a rough guide, here’s how the generational holdoever worked out, looking at particular presidents as representatives of certain generations:

    roxas (b. 1892) and his generation held sway from 46 to 53;

    magsaysay (b. 1907) took power, in a generational shift, in 53; garcia was a throwback to the older generation; macapagal belonged to magsaysay’s generation;

    marcos (b. 1917) was another generation, by 1973 his generation’s turn at the summit was due to expire.

    poised to replace marcos were other generations: gerry roxas represented those born in the 1920s; ninoy aquino, those born in the 30s.

    not until cory aquino, in the late 80s, did we get a president born in the 30s; ramos was a throwback to gerry roxas’s generation; estrada, a return to ninoy’s generation. but estrada had been discussed as presidential material even prior to martial law, if he’d become president in his 40s instead of his 60s, who knows…

    because they were held back, by the time the 1960s generation took power in the 1980s, they were tired and too compromised; and they, too, along with holdeovers from the previous eras, have only begun to relinquish control. it’s only within the last two elections (thanks in part to term limits) that younger leaders have come to the fore.

    if one assumes the continuation of the 4-year term, then for the sake of projection, this is what could have been. Assume a change of power every four years, a holdover for a generation being a maximum of two presidential terms; and that, the qualifying age for the presidency is 40 years old:

    1973: generation from the 20s/30s

    1977: generation from the 20s/30s

    1981: generation from the 30s/40s

    1985: generation from the 30s/40s

    1989: generation from the 40s/50s

    1994: generation from the 40s/50s

    1998: generation from the 50s/60s

    2002: generation from the 50s/60s

    the generation of president arroyo (b. 1948), then, which came to power in 2001, came to power more or less at the right time. but, between say, estrada and arroyo’s generations, there are two or more lost generations! and thus, lost opportunities.

    as for another point brian brings up: certainly if one generation doesn’t consciously transmit its knowledge and values to the next, then the next generation can’t be faulted for its ignorance or for thinking the knowledge and values have lost all relevance.

  87. mlq3 on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 1:31 pm 

    aba, inodoro… i love it: “she-who-shall-not-be-named.” love it. binigyan mo ako ng ideya para sa kolum….

    “ari pata and the halfwit prints.” with the kontrabida being lady maldemole, she who-shall-not-be-named.

    ahihihihi!

  88. inodoro ni emilie on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 1:35 pm 

    “ari pata and the halfwit prints”

    bwahaha. kool title.

  89. mlq3 on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 1:37 pm 

    inodoro, oo mga, hapi yun.

  90. Rom on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 2:04 pm 

    gentlefolk:i don’t think the older generations owe the younger generations any sort of apology. if you think about it, THEY fought the war; THEY brought us through one apocalyptic crises after another – the bay of pigs, the oil embargo, the dot.com collapse, the asian economic meltdown – and we’re still here. Sure they may have screwed up big time in some matters, but I tend to believe that they were doing the best they could under the circumstances.and we of the younger generation should not waste our breath complaining about how tough we have it. just my two cents to this fiery discussion

  91. Devilsadvc8 on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 6:49 pm 

    “Why don’t… you… want… us… to be… better… then your generation?”

    I don’t know Brian. You should ask the lolos and lolas here. after all, I am just 26. yes. is it dawning on you? that i belong in your generation? and yet to be assumed i am older than my years based from what I write here… hmm, frankly i don’t know if should be flattered or insulted.

    Do you see me blaming the oldies for things we can NOW make a difference with? if you are complaining abt them holding you back, then aren’t you being a little bratty?

    if you want to be “better,” then by all means do so. if you are really bent on it, no matter who blocks your way, no one can hold you back.

    it’s like me being angry for failing to get hired a hundred times to all those companies i’ve applied to. i’ll go home cursing the HR staff or the one interviewing me for cordoning off the jobs only to those of their own kind (average and unimaginative) and excluding people like me, an inborn genius (yes, that’s my ego talking) i tell myself they must’ve felt so threatened by me they didn’t wanna hire me and risk me taking their jobs.

    only i realized, that if im good, then sooner or later, i would be given the chance to prove myself. and when i was hired, im proud to say that for the months i worked at that company, i was always a top ranking employee.

    they say success is the greatest revenge one can have to those who rejected them. make that your motto Brian.

    that’s what drives me as well. to shame some of the pretentious writers out there and show them what i think of their “great” work. Captain Barbell and Fantastic Man? pwe.

    pent-up anger.i have that as well. imagine sending my resume and they didn’t even read it. does not belong in any of the universities mentioned in the ad, throw that one away.

    i am sorry mr.devil, but unless you have read the ad, we specifically mentioned not bothering to apply if you aren’t a graduate of one of the universities we listed.

    but, but i thought, i just thought that if you would give me a chance to write…

    well, you thought wrong mr. devil. we don’t waste time with people like you.

    Brian, you see me blaming these people? You see me giving up? I know in my heart what I’m worth. So if you have something to say, or something to prove, goddamit do your best to say or prove it!

  92. BrianB on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 8:30 pm 

    ROM,

    My Lolo fought the Japanese. His brother was beheaded in front of his family in a plaza ( I forget which plaza). I really liked my lolo. He used to pull my ear and probably hurt me more times physically compared to my father but he was a brave guy. I prefer being beaten up by someone who stood up for the Japanese and who wasn’t afraid of the mayayaman. I can’t say that about my father.

    Devil,

    Success doesn’t make my point, does it? Let’s say I suddenly became a billionaire and won the Nobel and no one of the older generation can look me in the eye in shame. Do you think that would make my point? No. Because it isn’t me that convinced them. It’s my billions and the Nobel. Get it?

  93. BrianB on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 9:18 pm 

    “rage, rage, brian, against the dying of the light. [wag ka lang munang mamundok.]”

    Like I said, I’m going to be a business man.

  94. Devilsadvc8 on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 10:39 pm 

    “Success doesn’t make my point, does it? Let’s say I suddenly became a billionaire and won the Nobel and no one of the older generation can look me in the eye in shame. Do you think that would make my point? No. Because it isn’t me that convinced them. It’s my billions and the Nobel. Get it?”

    Having a different view of what success is (for me it isn’t the riches nor the awards), I’d still say even if that didn’t “make your point” (whatever that means. perhaps it means proving one was right in the 1st place, kind of an ‘i told you so’) at least you would’ve done something which you set out to do. which was be better than the older generation or those who repudiated you. so what if you were never able to make your point to these people? if you hate their guts so much, do their opinion still really matter? i myself would’ve just smiled at them and be contented with what i have done.

    as i’ve said, why be pissed off at them and them holding you back? it’s been always like that ever since. the old generation making mistakes the young will then suffer, the old generation always acting that their generation is the better generation than the younger ‘uns, that kids nowadays are growing disrespectful and losing their sense of morals. that happens with every generation, and I bet ya it’ll happen w/ours (even if you and I are so smart not to get caught in this trap, a lot of our generation will be).

    when you’ve calmed down and stopped blaming them, you’ll realize that you are alive exactly for this reason. to fight them, and fight the fate given you (if it was a bad one).

    ah. you must be the kind of person that isn’t contented unless you’ve won an argument or someone else say’s “uncle.”

    well Brian, let’s wait till we grow old ourselve for them to say “uncle.” perhaps by then they’d have realized the error of their ways and apologize to us from their graves.

  95. BrianB on Thu, 2nd Aug 2007 11:00 pm 

    “well Brian, let’s wait till we grow old ourselve for them to say “uncle.” perhaps by then they’d have realized the error of their ways and apologize to us from their graves.”

    That’s up to you Devil, if you already want to act like a retiree at your young age.

  96. The Ca t on Fri, 3rd Aug 2007 1:26 am 

    I took it to mean, direct personal insults. Some of my posts had that and they were moderated while CAT’s wasn’t.

    Dear, dear. To console you, let be it known that mine too is being moderated not because I go out of bounds but because it’s the system, honey especially if you post comments at intervals of a few minutes only.

    I’ve been participating in forums from aol, pex and phno and there was never a time when I was banned, edited or thrown out from the discussions.

    As John Marzan has said, I have debated with B and the other political forum regulars some years back in the pex. I have been called names, killed in the cyber and stalked by a Silicon Valley racist thus the change in the handle. Otherwise, I should have kept my favorite alternick.

    Oh yeah, I was temporarily banned in the old pex when it changed ownership. One expat that I debated with was very much like BrianB, kulang na lang magsumbong sa Diyos para ako maparusahan. :)

    As DEvilsadvc has said, I seldom join in the discussion but I read each and every comment. I also read the links given by MLQ3.

    If someone encourages your rage, he is not losing but you.

    Tahan na. To acquire knowledge, one must study; but to acquire wisdom, one must observe.

  97. inodoro ni emilie on Fri, 3rd Aug 2007 7:53 am 

    know your metaphors, hane.

  98. benign0 on Fri, 3rd Aug 2007 8:17 am 

    “As John Marzan has said, I have debated with B and the other political forum regulars some years back in the pex. I have been called names, killed in the cyber and stalked by a Silicon Valley racist thus the change in the handle. Otherwise, I should have kept my favorite alternick.”

    Just to refresh your memory “Cat”, someone has in fact written about their experience in PEx back several years ago and you figure as one of the stars in that show:

    http://www.apmforum.com/columns/orientseas47.htm

    Maybe this is the “expat” you were referring to. ;) Hope a bit of therapy had helped your little tililings. Otherwise, to be fair, I think you’ve come a long way. ;)

    —–

    I think this whole debate about age came about because a few bozos brought up the topic in the first place. Age should be a non-issue. Ideas should be evaluated on the basis of their own internal logical merit.

  99. The Ca t on Fri, 3rd Aug 2007 9:42 am 

    Benigno,
    I think after all these years, you are the most unwanted commenter in the cyberspace. Imagine being banned by almost all forums.
    The columnist who you tried other people to believe that it is you is already deceased. Change your alternick Benigno. Kawawa naman si Teddy B.

    Ow, that expat who claimed that he started that call centers in the Philippines when he merely wrote an article about it. hahaha.

    The expat who generalized that Cebu women are P…

    The expat who claimed that he was a consultant but behaved like BrianB and rallied almost all people he knew to use different alternicks just to attack me. Pikon.

    Some kind of your strategy, isn’t it benigno? One that praises you to high heavens and another is a troll. Which among the posters here is one of yours? I saw one already.

    Hindi kita pinapatulan dahil ayaw kong mababoy itong forum ni MLQ3. Wherever you go, you create trouble because you think all Filipinos are stupid and you are the only one who is not.

    But you are not happy if Garfield won’t pay you attention. KSP ka parin. Hindi ka kasi sumikat kung hindi kita pinatulan. Bwahaha

  100. The Ca t on Fri, 3rd Aug 2007 9:47 am 

    If CAT were merely being sarcastic, I wonder if you can point out to me these sarcastic passages.

    Exercise pa baka sakaling mastretch pa yong IQ. :)
    Want dark choc? Good for the brain.

  101. The Ca t on Fri, 3rd Aug 2007 9:52 am 

    Brianb, maybe i wasn’t clear. by personal attack i mean death threats.

    Manolo,
    Baka akala niya kakalmutin siya ng Pusa. Sorry, I just had my manicure. :)

  102. The Ca t on Fri, 3rd Aug 2007 10:00 am 

    Like CAT for example. CAT, the usual snobberies in the real world don’t work. I can wear you out as I’m online 15 hours a day.

    HAHAHAHAHA. Can you attend to you my more than twenty websites. I just don’t have the time. HAHAHAHA

    As one crapper in this forum said, I am a sitemeter freak because students come to my websites for answers to their questions.

    Pasalamat ka pinansin kita. :)

  103. BrianB on Fri, 3rd Aug 2007 4:36 pm 

    Please do me the dishonor of leaving me alone. Thank God for all the blessings he’s given you, including your kano husband.

  104. BrianB on Fri, 3rd Aug 2007 4:43 pm 

    “Hindi kita pinapatulan dahil ayaw kong mababoy itong forum ni MLQ3. Wherever you go, you create trouble because you think all Filipinos are stupid and you are the only one who is not.”

    I’d take a cultural saboteur like Benign0 every day than a Nazi called CAT.

  105. grd on Fri, 3rd Aug 2007 7:28 pm 

    what’s the problem with this pussycat? why the indiscriminate firing? wants to get everybody’s attention?

  106. benign0 on Sat, 4th Aug 2007 6:00 am 

    Don’t look now, but someone here is on a tililing rampage… ;)

  107. The Ca t on Sat, 4th Aug 2007 11:25 am 

    grd,

    Come out from your orig. alternick saka ka malipag-usap sa akin. Otherwise, you are a big W.

  108. The Ca t on Sat, 4th Aug 2007 11:28 am 

    benigno,
    Did you bring your alternick with you?

    Desperate to promote the stale getrealwebiste which recommendations are “suntok sa buwan lahay. Trying hard-economic analyst, GDP lang di pa alam. NAtutuhan lang sa pakikipagdebate kay Pusa.

  109. The Ca t on Sat, 4th Aug 2007 11:29 am 

    Brianb,
    inggit lang saiyo. mumog ka lang ng Listerine baka umabot sa utak mo, malinis lahat ang baggage diyan sa iyong little brain.

  110. BrianB on Sun, 5th Aug 2007 5:48 am 

    “inggit lang saiyo. mumog ka lang ng Listerine baka umabot sa utak mo, malinis lahat ang baggage diyan sa iyong little brain.”

    Yeah, there are people who’d say my dick is literally bigger than my brain. I used to think this is flattery, but CAT has enlightened me.

  111. BrianB on Sun, 5th Aug 2007 5:50 am 

    Dang,

    Look at Manolo’s alexa rating.
    http://www.alexa.com/data/details/traffic_details?url=quezon.ph

    Uy, ako ata maykagagawan nito. Ako yung bago eh, diba? Nak,s dis da first time you were on top 100k?

  112. Devilsadvc8 on Sun, 5th Aug 2007 12:46 pm 

    Brian, tagal na sa ranking yan si Manolo. top 10 pa. so dnt get ur egos up.

  113. BrianB on Sun, 5th Aug 2007 4:04 pm 

    Devil. No way. this is the highest he’s got in over a year.

  114. Devilsadvc8 on Sun, 5th Aug 2007 10:42 pm 

    whatever

  115. The Ca t on Mon, 6th Aug 2007 12:30 am 

    Look at Manolo’s alexa rating.
    http://www.alexa.com/data/details/traffic_details?url=quezon.ph

    Uy, ako ata maykagagawan nito. Ako yung bago eh, diba? Nak,s dis da first time you were on top 100k?

    Do not claim the credit. Manolo is Manolo even when I was just a kitten in the cyber. Baka ikaw ang nakakuha ng hits mo dito para malaman kung sino itong batang pinabili lang ng suka, nakikipagdebatehan na sa mga eksperto. Buti sana kung may laman naman.

  116. The Ca t on Mon, 6th Aug 2007 12:52 am 

    BB,
    I do not mean what I said that you were just asked to run an errand to buy a bottle of vinegar. Binabawi ko.

    O eto ang sukli. Tumaas na ang presyo ng suka.

  117. rere on Thu, 15th Nov 2007 2:04 am 

    you suck

Tell us what you're thinking...
and oh, if you want a pic to show with your comment, go get a gravatar!

You must be logged in to post a comment.