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	<title>Comments on: Old and new</title>
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	<description>Punditry. Politics. History. Commentary.</description>
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		<title>By: vic</title>
		<link>http://www.quezon.ph/2006/09/01/old-and-new/comment-page-2/#comment-36440</link>
		<dc:creator>vic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Sep 2006 06:46:14 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Walmart, the Home Depot and lots of retail Businesses are some of the Biggest employers now both side of the borders. Due to stiff competition from Chinese cheaper produced goods, businesses here, both in the U.S. and in Canada have to CUT cost in order to compete. ThatÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s the reality.  ThatÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s where the Govt. And business leaders on both sides have to develop some kind of strategies that the reduced and lower pays and salaries should not affect much  the standard of living of its citizen by outsourcing and  taking advantage the availability of such talents abroad without the hassle of bringing the bodies in.  Walmart, Macdonald, pays just slightly above the minimum, maybe $8-10/hr, but as a part time second job and a secure pension plan, free health care, free secondary education, subsidized university, what you take home is yours and yours alone to spend. Now if you happen to be a nurse or a doctor or a dentist, forget being a businessman, its up and down, youÃ¢â‚¬â„¢re home free.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Walmart, the Home Depot and lots of retail Businesses are some of the Biggest employers now both side of the borders. Due to stiff competition from Chinese cheaper produced goods, businesses here, both in the U.S. and in Canada have to CUT cost in order to compete. ThatÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s the reality.  ThatÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s where the Govt. And business leaders on both sides have to develop some kind of strategies that the reduced and lower pays and salaries should not affect much  the standard of living of its citizen by outsourcing and  taking advantage the availability of such talents abroad without the hassle of bringing the bodies in.  Walmart, Macdonald, pays just slightly above the minimum, maybe $8-10/hr, but as a part time second job and a secure pension plan, free health care, free secondary education, subsidized university, what you take home is yours and yours alone to spend. Now if you happen to be a nurse or a doctor or a dentist, forget being a businessman, its up and down, youÃ¢â‚¬â„¢re home free.</p>
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		<title>By: cvj</title>
		<link>http://www.quezon.ph/2006/09/01/old-and-new/comment-page-2/#comment-36439</link>
		<dc:creator>cvj</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Sep 2006 06:44:58 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Antonio, whether it&#039;s in government or the corporate sector, i don&#039;t place that much faith in &#039;strategic planning&#039;. It has proven to be an ineffective tool.  I can understand the need when it comes to infrastructure (e.g. roads, bridges, public housing, mass transit, power) to plan years in advance because these activities take time to implement, but beyond that, any &#039;strategy&#039; in the area of business and labor opportunities would be too speculative to be useful. If government invests resources in these activities, chances of payoff are slim.  They are better off focusing on what is real now and organize for agility. It&#039;s better to leave strategy and vision to entrepreneurs who have the aptitude and stomach for it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Antonio, whether it&#8217;s in government or the corporate sector, i don&#8217;t place that much faith in &#8216;strategic planning&#8217;. It has proven to be an ineffective tool.  I can understand the need when it comes to infrastructure (e.g. roads, bridges, public housing, mass transit, power) to plan years in advance because these activities take time to implement, but beyond that, any &#8216;strategy&#8217; in the area of business and labor opportunities would be too speculative to be useful. If government invests resources in these activities, chances of payoff are slim.  They are better off focusing on what is real now and organize for agility. It&#8217;s better to leave strategy and vision to entrepreneurs who have the aptitude and stomach for it.</p>
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		<title>By: Carl</title>
		<link>http://www.quezon.ph/2006/09/01/old-and-new/comment-page-2/#comment-36438</link>
		<dc:creator>Carl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Sep 2006 06:26:25 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Amadeo said: &quot;Thanks for the revealing inputs on the current operations of PhilPack, especially the part about contract growing which is quite popular in at least one other industry in the area, poultry and egg production. But are the Lorenzo brothers still in management? &quot;




From what my suppliers and associates in Cagayan de Oro tell me, yes the Lorenzo brothers have been retained. It could be part of the deal when they sold out to San Miguel Corp. and the UFC group, at least until the new management familiarizes itself. I doubt very much whether it is a long-term arrangement. Sooner or later, Danding Cojuangco (or his alter ego, Ramon Ang) will want to run things his way. Butch Campos will probably also have his own ideas. Most likely, under the new ownership, which is primarily Chinese, management will take on a more pragmatic, no-frills approach. The plan to shift to toll processing seems to come from the new owners.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amadeo said: &#8220;Thanks for the revealing inputs on the current operations of PhilPack, especially the part about contract growing which is quite popular in at least one other industry in the area, poultry and egg production. But are the Lorenzo brothers still in management? &#8221;</p>
<p>From what my suppliers and associates in Cagayan de Oro tell me, yes the Lorenzo brothers have been retained. It could be part of the deal when they sold out to San Miguel Corp. and the UFC group, at least until the new management familiarizes itself. I doubt very much whether it is a long-term arrangement. Sooner or later, Danding Cojuangco (or his alter ego, Ramon Ang) will want to run things his way. Butch Campos will probably also have his own ideas. Most likely, under the new ownership, which is primarily Chinese, management will take on a more pragmatic, no-frills approach. The plan to shift to toll processing seems to come from the new owners.</p>
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		<title>By: antonio walanglaban</title>
		<link>http://www.quezon.ph/2006/09/01/old-and-new/comment-page-2/#comment-36432</link>
		<dc:creator>antonio walanglaban</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Sep 2006 05:19:10 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>i disagree, cvj. Opportunistim is a sterile solution. Strategic is how government should be. If you demand otherwise, you are asking for too little from our leaders.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i disagree, cvj. Opportunistim is a sterile solution. Strategic is how government should be. If you demand otherwise, you are asking for too little from our leaders.</p>
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		<title>By: cvj</title>
		<link>http://www.quezon.ph/2006/09/01/old-and-new/comment-page-2/#comment-36414</link>
		<dc:creator>cvj</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Sep 2006 03:25:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.quezon.ph/?p=1014#comment-36414</guid>
		<description>Amadeo, you bring up a very important distinction which i missed out.  (In IT, i&#039;m used to seeing contractuals earning more than the regular employees like me.)   For the contractual workers in the Philippines, i think they are  &#039;hired&#039; and &#039;fired&#039; regularly as a way of getting around labor law which should probably be revised to acknowledge business realities.  

I remember sometime in the late 80&#039;s, Citibank had this big strike with its janitors and other admin staff who were hired directly on long-term contract basis.  If i&#039;m not mistaken, Citibank lost.  After that, businesses started sourcing clerical, janitorial and other staff services from contracting agencies.  I don&#039;t think there&#039;s anything wrong with the model, but income disparities could be addressed by increasing the minimum wage.   Also, in the retail area, letting in WalMart (if they care to) looks like a step up for the Philippines, despite its reputation as an employer in the US.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amadeo, you bring up a very important distinction which i missed out.  (In IT, i&#8217;m used to seeing contractuals earning more than the regular employees like me.)   For the contractual workers in the Philippines, i think they are  &#8216;hired&#8217; and &#8216;fired&#8217; regularly as a way of getting around labor law which should probably be revised to acknowledge business realities.  </p>
<p>I remember sometime in the late 80&#8242;s, Citibank had this big strike with its janitors and other admin staff who were hired directly on long-term contract basis.  If i&#8217;m not mistaken, Citibank lost.  After that, businesses started sourcing clerical, janitorial and other staff services from contracting agencies.  I don&#8217;t think there&#8217;s anything wrong with the model, but income disparities could be addressed by increasing the minimum wage.   Also, in the retail area, letting in WalMart (if they care to) looks like a step up for the Philippines, despite its reputation as an employer in the US.</p>
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		<title>By: Amadeo</title>
		<link>http://www.quezon.ph/2006/09/01/old-and-new/comment-page-2/#comment-36404</link>
		<dc:creator>Amadeo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Sep 2006 02:51:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.quezon.ph/?p=1014#comment-36404</guid>
		<description>Cvj:

We may have to differentiate between contract work being done by skilled/technical people over those done by unskilled or entry-level workers.  Contract work in more developed countries can be very lucrative and rewarding.  I know because I tried it once between jobs. Unfortunately, typical in the Philippine context is the contractual worker, say, in malls that only have tenure good for six months, fired and rehired as a perpetual temporary employee, sans permanent tenure and benefits.

Thus, we have the supposedly contractual king in Philippine business, for example, prosperous enough to be counted among ForbesÃ¢â‚¬â„¢ list of billionaires in dollars, but maintaining a cadre of contractual employees subsisting on threadbare wages.  Shades of Wal-Mart, maybe?  Yes, but Wal-Mart employees have permanent employment and invested with various fringe benefits.

When I had an extended visit to the old homeland last year, I informally interviewed some of the employees of the newly-opened grandiose mall in our city in Northern Mindanao.  Typically, a sales worker in one of the food outlets owned and managed by the mall owner was getting a daily wage of 115 pesos gross.  Imagine how meager the daily take home pay would be, deducting travel and grooming expenses. One particular employee had to deduct 20 pesos travel expenses daily.

Re unemployment figures, the US now shows under 5% unemployment (as low as 4.7%).  But not being addressed are two factors necessarily impacting on this rate, the 10 million or so illegals who work under the shadows of the underground economy and secondly, what could be considered the countryÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s full employment level as enunciated by Keynes.  Economists in the past point to 5.2+% as full employment level for the US, taking into account the countryÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s specific dynamics and accounting for that part of the labor force that will purposely or because of personal circumstances avoid getting into the workforce.

Carl:

Thanks for the revealing inputs on the current operations of PhilPack, especially the part about contract growing which is quite popular in at least one other industry in the area, poultry and egg production.  But are the Lorenzo brothers still in management?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Cvj:</p>
<p>We may have to differentiate between contract work being done by skilled/technical people over those done by unskilled or entry-level workers.  Contract work in more developed countries can be very lucrative and rewarding.  I know because I tried it once between jobs. Unfortunately, typical in the Philippine context is the contractual worker, say, in malls that only have tenure good for six months, fired and rehired as a perpetual temporary employee, sans permanent tenure and benefits.</p>
<p>Thus, we have the supposedly contractual king in Philippine business, for example, prosperous enough to be counted among ForbesÃ¢â‚¬â„¢ list of billionaires in dollars, but maintaining a cadre of contractual employees subsisting on threadbare wages.  Shades of Wal-Mart, maybe?  Yes, but Wal-Mart employees have permanent employment and invested with various fringe benefits.</p>
<p>When I had an extended visit to the old homeland last year, I informally interviewed some of the employees of the newly-opened grandiose mall in our city in Northern Mindanao.  Typically, a sales worker in one of the food outlets owned and managed by the mall owner was getting a daily wage of 115 pesos gross.  Imagine how meager the daily take home pay would be, deducting travel and grooming expenses. One particular employee had to deduct 20 pesos travel expenses daily.</p>
<p>Re unemployment figures, the US now shows under 5% unemployment (as low as 4.7%).  But not being addressed are two factors necessarily impacting on this rate, the 10 million or so illegals who work under the shadows of the underground economy and secondly, what could be considered the countryÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s full employment level as enunciated by Keynes.  Economists in the past point to 5.2+% as full employment level for the US, taking into account the countryÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s specific dynamics and accounting for that part of the labor force that will purposely or because of personal circumstances avoid getting into the workforce.</p>
<p>Carl:</p>
<p>Thanks for the revealing inputs on the current operations of PhilPack, especially the part about contract growing which is quite popular in at least one other industry in the area, poultry and egg production.  But are the Lorenzo brothers still in management?</p>
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		<title>By: cvj</title>
		<link>http://www.quezon.ph/2006/09/01/old-and-new/comment-page-2/#comment-36393</link>
		<dc:creator>cvj</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Sep 2006 01:52:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.quezon.ph/?p=1014#comment-36393</guid>
		<description>Antonio, i&#039;m sorry i did not see your response (@12:13am).  On underachievement,i take your point.  Unfortunately, while the economics graduate may be capable of much more, he has to adjust to the available jobs.   The work that the developed countries usually farm out overseas are those that are labor intensive, but routine (e.g. call center work, transcription, software coding and testing).  Being &#039;opportunistic&#039; is precisely what we want the government to be in terms of finding jobs for our people.  Conversely, it also needs to address local labor shortages (e.g. of doctors &amp; nurses) by liberalizing the importation of labor.   It&#039;s the only institution that has the capability of being a placement office of last resort - both directions.   Government can facilitate charting the course for the future, but this is more the expertise of business-education sector partnerships.

On trade liberalization, it&#039;s a good idea whether on not Chavez agrees with it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Antonio, i&#8217;m sorry i did not see your response (@12:13am).  On underachievement,i take your point.  Unfortunately, while the economics graduate may be capable of much more, he has to adjust to the available jobs.   The work that the developed countries usually farm out overseas are those that are labor intensive, but routine (e.g. call center work, transcription, software coding and testing).  Being &#8216;opportunistic&#8217; is precisely what we want the government to be in terms of finding jobs for our people.  Conversely, it also needs to address local labor shortages (e.g. of doctors &amp; nurses) by liberalizing the importation of labor.   It&#8217;s the only institution that has the capability of being a placement office of last resort &#8211; both directions.   Government can facilitate charting the course for the future, but this is more the expertise of business-education sector partnerships.</p>
<p>On trade liberalization, it&#8217;s a good idea whether on not Chavez agrees with it.</p>
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		<title>By: Carl</title>
		<link>http://www.quezon.ph/2006/09/01/old-and-new/comment-page-2/#comment-36371</link>
		<dc:creator>Carl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Sep 2006 00:13:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.quezon.ph/?p=1014#comment-36371</guid>
		<description>Amadeo said: &quot;To highlight, in the case of our own Northern Mindanao economic mainstay, Philippine Packing Corporation (Del Monte, which I believe is still controlled and operated by the Lorenzos), I am told by a former employee that at present the company cultivates twice the hectarage compared to when the Americans operated the place. But surprisingly, the company employee rolls have been significantly reduced. They have been replaced by contract workers.&quot;



The case of Del Monte Corp. is one of the few cases wherein land reform succeeded. And this is in no way due to government. Land reform was successful with Del Monte because the company itself provided the infrastructure, the planting material, the know-how, the inputs, etc. So, instead of the company running everything (it still supervises, to make sure everything is done correctly), it has made the farmer-beneficiaries (who are mostly former Del Monte employees) into contract growers. It is a win-win situation, as the beneficiaries can maximize production and profit from it. The company, on the other hand, is not saddled with so many fixed costs and labor demands. 



Right now, only the processing plants are company-owned. But the new owners, the Yao Campos family of UFC ketchup and San Miguel Corp. (this should answer the question of whether the Lorenzo family still owned the company), are inclined to spin that off to the employees, too. That way, Del Monte will only pay a tolling fee to process their products. Basically, it will transform the company into a marketing company banking on a heavyweight brand. ItÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s quite an innovation here in the Philippines, where our concept of wealth relates to the amount of  property and assets a person or an entity holds. There is wealth in a brand and the ability to market it.



At the same time, this allows the company to focus primarily on its core activity, which is marketing and not be sidetracked by the production aspect and its attendant day-to-day problems. It also allows the company to be much more flexible. In other words, if the farmer-producers are not efficient, the company can buy from other places, such as Davao and Gen. Santos. Or even go to Thailand or Indonesia. Fortunately, things seem to be working out very well and hectarage has increased tremendously, with independent growers coming in. So far, it has been very beneficial to the economy in Mindanao.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amadeo said: &#8220;To highlight, in the case of our own Northern Mindanao economic mainstay, Philippine Packing Corporation (Del Monte, which I believe is still controlled and operated by the Lorenzos), I am told by a former employee that at present the company cultivates twice the hectarage compared to when the Americans operated the place. But surprisingly, the company employee rolls have been significantly reduced. They have been replaced by contract workers.&#8221;</p>
<p>The case of Del Monte Corp. is one of the few cases wherein land reform succeeded. And this is in no way due to government. Land reform was successful with Del Monte because the company itself provided the infrastructure, the planting material, the know-how, the inputs, etc. So, instead of the company running everything (it still supervises, to make sure everything is done correctly), it has made the farmer-beneficiaries (who are mostly former Del Monte employees) into contract growers. It is a win-win situation, as the beneficiaries can maximize production and profit from it. The company, on the other hand, is not saddled with so many fixed costs and labor demands. </p>
<p>Right now, only the processing plants are company-owned. But the new owners, the Yao Campos family of UFC ketchup and San Miguel Corp. (this should answer the question of whether the Lorenzo family still owned the company), are inclined to spin that off to the employees, too. That way, Del Monte will only pay a tolling fee to process their products. Basically, it will transform the company into a marketing company banking on a heavyweight brand. ItÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s quite an innovation here in the Philippines, where our concept of wealth relates to the amount of  property and assets a person or an entity holds. There is wealth in a brand and the ability to market it.</p>
<p>At the same time, this allows the company to focus primarily on its core activity, which is marketing and not be sidetracked by the production aspect and its attendant day-to-day problems. It also allows the company to be much more flexible. In other words, if the farmer-producers are not efficient, the company can buy from other places, such as Davao and Gen. Santos. Or even go to Thailand or Indonesia. Fortunately, things seem to be working out very well and hectarage has increased tremendously, with independent growers coming in. So far, it has been very beneficial to the economy in Mindanao.</p>
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		<title>By: cvj</title>
		<link>http://www.quezon.ph/2006/09/01/old-and-new/comment-page-2/#comment-36315</link>
		<dc:creator>cvj</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Sep 2006 17:23:44 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>tbl, maybe your right, it&#039;s just my bias showing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>tbl, maybe your right, it&#8217;s just my bias showing.</p>
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		<title>By: cvj</title>
		<link>http://www.quezon.ph/2006/09/01/old-and-new/comment-page-2/#comment-36314</link>
		<dc:creator>cvj</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Sep 2006 17:19:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.quezon.ph/?p=1014#comment-36314</guid>
		<description>Amadeo, i agree with your treatment of call-center and other &#039;dead-end&#039; jobs.  The &#039;constant flux&#039; is something we have to live with. Even for industry insiders, it&#039;s  hard to predict were the business will go and how these jobs will evolve.  Even in India, they say that they excel in Information Technology and beauty contests because these are the areas where their government is not involved.   All government can do is to have its ears close to the ground and help the country grab as much of the low hanging fruit opportunities in whatever area is Ã¢â‚¬ËœhotÃ¢â‚¬â„¢ while it can.    Vision exercises in the area of industrial policy or ICT policy are hit and miss affairs so we cannot count on these to deliver.

As for contract work, i think it&#039;s one of the solutions to underemployment, not its symptom.  Businesses have to be flexible to survive.  What distinguishes the USA which has 5% unemployment from Europe which has double or triple that rate is the ability to easily hire and fire people.  If we have labor laws that make it difficult to let go of people or force businesses to make workers permanent, then they would be more hesitant to hire. Along with outsourcing, contract work is the trend and people would just have to accept this reality.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amadeo, i agree with your treatment of call-center and other &#8216;dead-end&#8217; jobs.  The &#8216;constant flux&#8217; is something we have to live with. Even for industry insiders, it&#8217;s  hard to predict were the business will go and how these jobs will evolve.  Even in India, they say that they excel in Information Technology and beauty contests because these are the areas where their government is not involved.   All government can do is to have its ears close to the ground and help the country grab as much of the low hanging fruit opportunities in whatever area is Ã¢â‚¬ËœhotÃ¢â‚¬â„¢ while it can.    Vision exercises in the area of industrial policy or ICT policy are hit and miss affairs so we cannot count on these to deliver.</p>
<p>As for contract work, i think it&#8217;s one of the solutions to underemployment, not its symptom.  Businesses have to be flexible to survive.  What distinguishes the USA which has 5% unemployment from Europe which has double or triple that rate is the ability to easily hire and fire people.  If we have labor laws that make it difficult to let go of people or force businesses to make workers permanent, then they would be more hesitant to hire. Along with outsourcing, contract work is the trend and people would just have to accept this reality.</p>
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